just wont run right!!!!! 2001 cylinder 4 misfire

You can borrow a compression testor from any Auto Parts store for a small deposit.

1) Try to isolate noise to bank 1 (cylinders 1-4), or bank 2 (cylinders 5-8).
2) A Local muffler shop can do a back pressure test on your catalytic converters.

Physical cylinder assignment-
Tran
4 8
3 7
2 6
1 5
FAN

The Lincoln LS & Jaguar S type are like bad sisters!

see http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=954555

Do a compression test on cylinders 5-8 (bank2), it sounds like bent valves, because of a bad secondary cam chain tensioner.

The DTC's will tell you the valves on which cylinder! P0305,P0306,P0307, and P0308.
If it's just #7 isolate the injector wire, and cop connector going to that cylinder.

How many times do you guys let the compression hit the meter?

Briefly I got,

1=190
2=195
3=180
4=185
5=190
6=195
7=180
8=190

Oh this sounds so much like mine.

http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=59886

Hey!
The compression looks good, so it may just be a rattle in the secondary cam chain tensioner.
What's the deal with alum tape on your Air tube from the valve cover to your Air duct work?
Unmetered air will cause problems!

Yea, Im going to order the secondary tensioners.

Im thinking these.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350312408299

Dont suppose auto parts stores have them.

Don't forget to get new spark plug boss seals and valve cover gaskets.

at a idle you can feel the car misfiring. but when your driving you dont really feel it. and the exaust smells a little rich.

have you rualed out the egr since your saying burns rich?

Don't forget to get new spark plug boss seals and valve cover gaskets.

Yea, thought I would pick those up locally. This thing has had the valve cover gaskets replaced twice on it since we've owned it.
Last time it was 700 bucks for dealer to do them. I really dread the drivers side with all the hoses.

Will take pics as the job goes. Just hope I dont find more problems with the primaries and chains.

1) When you do this job, leave the primary cam to crank timing alone.
2) Lift the secondary cam without losing cam to cam timing and sneak the new secondary cam chain tensioner in.

Gotcha. Secondary cam only.


Whats the premium valve cover gaskets to get, and where?

The parts stores are showing Felpros.

I got mine from http://www.autopartswarehouse.com , they were Felpro.

This car doesn't have an EGR valve, so that's one less problem.

I still don't think that Aluminum tape around the Air tube from the Air Intake duct work going to the valve cover might be giving a lean/rich condition, because of unmetered air leaks.

I got mine from http://www.autopartswarehouse.com , they were Felpro.

This car doesn't have an EGR valve, so that's one less problem.

I still don't think that Aluminum tape around the Air tube from the Air Intake duct work going to the valve cover might be giving a lean/rich condition, because of unmetered air leaks.

The V8 doesn't have a PCV valve, but it does have an EGR valve.

Well.................found the noise.
And let me say what a pain in the :swear: to get down to the right valve cover.
Lets just say the garage last Saturday was not a happy place.
And one damn screw in particular!

As you diy'ers can see, the tensioner lost its upper slide.
Notice where the chain started to eat into the block.

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t137/ncmach1/Lincoln/IMG_3791.jpg

1) When you do this job, leave the primary cam to crank timing alone.
2) Lift the secondary cam without losing cam to cam timing and sneak the new secondary cam chain tensioner in.

So where do I look to make sure I dont screw up the timing, or do I just make a mark and be sure to go back the same way?
Oh btw, whats the recommended torque on the cam bolts?

So where do I look to make sure I dont screw up the timing, or do I just make a mark and be sure to go back the same way?
Oh btw, whats the recommended torque on the cam bolts?


Caution -
1) Put some clean shop towels in the timing chain cover, so you don't lose any bolts, or nuts.
2) Get a torgue wrench, and check the bottom cam bolts for torgue befor removing.
3) Remove all the bolts on the lower cam.
4) Remove the bolts holding the secondary cam chain tensioner.
5) Lift the lower cam and keep a little tension on secondary chain, so you don't lose the cam to cam timing.
6) Remove the old secondary cam chain tensioner, and slide the new one in.
7) Put the lower cam back in.
8) Torque the bolts for the tensioner.
9) Torque the bolts for the secondary cam.

I'am sorry about torque specs, because my http://www.alldata.com has expired.

LOL - You should do a AF - YouTube video for this procedure, it usually takes me 2 1/2hrs.

Caution -
...2) Get a torgue wrench, and check the bottom cam bolts for torgue befor removing.
...

You cannot measure the torque to tighten a bolt to by measuring the torque that it takes to loosen it. Test this out sometime. Tighten a bolt to a specific torque, then measure how much torque it takes to loosen it. It will be different. I have the gen II manuals, but not the gen I.

At http://www.helminc.com/helm/welcome_select_oem.asp?Style=helm
you can subscribe to the factory service manual for $20 for one month. I suspect it would be well worth it for 34Ford to do this.

Caution -


LOL - You should do a AF - YouTube video for this procedure, it usually takes me 2 1/2hrs.

2 1/2 hours! What?

Well if I had to do it over again I might could do it that fast but that damn plastic wiring housing on the back on the motor really pissed me off. Especially the bass ackards nut facing the firewall.
And then there was that wire connector way back there behind the valve cover. What the heck is that thing it connects to on the head?
And the squeeze connectors on the hoses, argh!:mad:

Are we going tobe able to hear your car on youtube today?
Only do bank2 for now, you can always do bank1 on another day.

How far is Black Mountain, NC. from Garner, NC 27529?

You cannot measure the torque to tighten a bolt to by measuring the torque that it takes to loosen it. Test this out sometime. Tighten a bolt to a specific torque, then measure how much torque it takes to loosen it. It will be different. I have the gen II manuals, but not the gen I.

At http://www.helminc.com/helm/welcome_select_oem.asp?Style=helm
you can subscribe to the factory service manual for $20 for one month. I suspect it would be well worth it for 34Ford to do this.

Caution - Never use a torque wrench to loosen bolts, it could mess up the calibration. We were just trying a cheap way of how tight the cam bolts were.

I'm not going to do anything till I find a torque for the cam bolts.

I'm not going to do anything till I find a torque for the cam bolts.

If you'd like the steps from the 2002 manual, send me a Private Message with your e-mail address and I'll send you a PDF.

-Rod

Well I guess I need to start a new thread on 3.9's with bad tensioners and cams out of time.

No wonder it was missing. Look at the height of the chain and how far the secondary cam is out of time.

I hate to think how bad its going to be to get the new chain on.
Can you get enough slack on the primary cam at the front to put the chain over the ends on both cams, at the same time?

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t137/ncmach1/Lincoln/IMG_3799.jpg

[quote=34Ford;6867097]How many times do you guys let the compression hit the meter?

Briefly I got,

1=190
2=195
3=180
4=185
5=190
6=195
7=180
8=190[/quote

The pic look's good, the 3rd generation secondary cam chain tensioners are metal.

Did you loose the cam to cam timing?

The compression looked good befor, so there wasn't any bent valves.

Hum, your right.

I made sure I didn't let the chain get slack enough to jump a tooth when I put the tensioner in.

I will turn that cam this evening, (take out the slack), just to see if it has jumped a tooth or not.

Well one things for sure, the chain is stretched. I hope the chains with a master link is ok to use.

I thought mine was stretched too, but it was ok!
How could it stretch from cam to cam?
Is the new secondary tensioner doing it's job taking the slack?
How how much play is allowed?

Did you do another compression test on bank 2, cylinders 5-8?

I thought mine was stretched too, but it was ok!
How could it stretch from cam to cam?
Is the new secondary tensioner doing it's job taking the slack?
How how much play is allowed?

You bring up a good point. I better make sure I dont have the wrong tensioner on the wrong side.

The picture looks good, if the cam chain is riding on top of the tensioner?
Just make sure you pull the pin to release the tensioner?

There's a stamp on the tensioners for L, or R bank.

Gotta be the chain. The tensioner is full out and the chain still has slop.
Bought a chain breaker yesterday so I wouldn't have to do any grinding.

If taking off the chain there's a tool to lock both cam's together, so you don't lose the cam to cam timing.

Heres the thing. I thought if all 4 cams has the flats facing up, then their in time.

As you can see that one cam is not facing up like the other three.

So why lock them, if the one is out? My thinking is take chain off, face the flat up, tighten new chain.

You might want to check with these guys, see http://www.jagservice.net/jaguar_v8_secondary_tensioners.htm
Notice the bent valves, because of a broken chain.

I talked to another Technician, he's said ''don't touch the chain, it will have a little slack.''

HI 34FORD

Going by Black Mt, and going to the Smokies next week, did you get this car fixed?

Yea, put it back together last Saturday. She has driven it everyday since and sounds much better.

Still has a p0308 code.

Cool!

Troubleshoot P0308 - Misfire on cylinder 8

1) Look for a loose connection on fuel injector, and the COP going to cylinder 8.
2) Reset & clear code
3) Monitor
4) Do a Google ''Lincoln LS drive cycle''

If it come's back suspect:
Cylinder 8

COP
Spark plug
Fuel injector
Compression

Got back from Cherokee casino and Michael Bolten concert this morng, we flew by Black Mountain.
I was thinking about your problem and wonder if you got your DTC P0308 fixed yet?

If cylinder 8 is still missing it could lead to a bad catalytic converter on bank 2(P0430).

Yea, I was out in the garage all day Saturday installing back up lights in my RZR.

Anyway the ole Linc's engine light went out and the wife said it been running fine.
Go figure.

have the same thing and checked everything. tired of this car. just checked cam timing and found bank 1 exuast cam off by a tooth. adj it and putting it back tougether now. crazy fhantom miss on cyl 4.

fixed the magic miss. check the cam timing. all 4 flats on the cam shafts have to be flat in line almost perfect had bank 1 ex cam off just a few degeres, caused the miss. there are no teeth on the gears to cam, so aparently they can turn on the camshafts. before you spend any money check first. all you have to do is pull the valve covers and turn the motor over.

fixed the magic miss. check the cam timing. all 4 flats on the cam shafts have to be flat in line almost perfect had bank 1 ex cam off just a few degeres, caused the miss. there are no teeth on the gears to cam, so aparently they can turn on the camshafts. before you spend any money check first. all you have to do is pull the valve covers and turn the motor over.



Yours will jump again if you haven't fixed the real problem. The real problem is that the timing chain guides and tensioners wear out.

misunderstanding not teeth on the gear for the chain. teeth where the gear and the cam bolt together. it's smooth so when you loosen the torx bolt the gear can turn on the cam. bolt torque is all that keeps it from moving, so if the torx bolt is not tight enough or something should happen that could jerk the gear or bind the cam it can turn. thus moving the exuast cam in relation to the gear changing the timing

misunderstanding not teeth on the gear for the chain. teeth where the gear and the cam bolt together. it's smooth so when you loosen the torx bolt the gear can turn on the cam. bolt torque is all that keeps it from moving, so if the torx bolt is not tight enough or something should happen that could jerk the gear or bind the cam it can turn. thus moving the exuast cam in relation to the gear changing the timing

Okay. I think that the correct term would be "splines."