2000 5.7l Express won't start

Hey Everyone,

Having a tough time figuring this one out! The 5.7 will not start, it turns over and I have some what of a spark from the coil wire to the block when I tested it, I also have spark to a test sparkplug when I held it to the exhaust manifold but I'm not sure if it's at it's at the proper output level since I don't have a calibrated spark tester. Anyway here is what I've replaced so far, The module, coil, crankshaft position sensor, and yes I'm broke now... When you turn the key on you can here the fuel pump come on and shut off once it hits 64psi according to my gauge, so it appears to be in the right range....I looked the wiring over but don't see anything that could be a possible problem. Please does anyone have idea what I should do next?????

Welcome to AF. Does it start with starting fluid sprayed into the intake? Lots of problems with caps, rotors and the coil wires in my experience.

Hey "M"

Sorry for the delay, I was searching through the another threads about starting! Lots of good stuff there, Anyway to answer your reply, no I haven't tried the starting fluid, I spent all day double checking everything...module coil etc. Do I just take the air filter element out and some fluild in the box? or do I have to get passed all that I guess after the mass air-flow sensor...let me know if you have time Thanks for the help

Hey "M"

Should the starting fluild fire it up, would that mean I have contaminated fuel in the tank since I have 64psi at the rail.

Use a noid light the security system will off shut power to the injectors. Other people have had this problem. As Max Wedge stated it should start and run as long as its getting starting fluid. This is a picture of one.
http://www.autopart.com/tools/toolsmain/tool/T_3401.htm A single one would be 3410. Most parts store sell them but the kit is a lot cheaper than what I paid.

Hey RH

Can you help me with the starting fluild??? Do I pull the boot off of the throttle body at the intake or just pull the air box out and get passed the sensors, and just a quick shot right.....Also new cap, rotor, wires, plugs, Thanks for the help

I would remove the boot at the throttle body. Have somebody else try to start it as you you give it a couple of sprays as it starts continue enough to keep it running. Open it so the spray goes into the engine.
I remember a post and he gave the wrong engine and everybody thought low fuel pressure but his security system shut it down.

Hey RH

Got ya, I've already pulled the boot back and opened the throttlebody and shot a couple of squirts in and then tried to crank but it didn't help any....didn't try and hold it open while someone sprayed "Standby I'll give it a try"

RH,

No luck on the starting fluid, I put the boot back on, and then pulled the wires off the cap so I could take the cap completely off the dist. it looked fine but I hit the poles with a piece of cloth anyway and the rotor too, still no luck after I put it all back together....checked for spark again from the coil
piece of wire from the block to the coil wire and still get a spark but it'[s not super blue looking.....Oh code 1351 but checked all the electrical plugs and wires they look ok...only thing I haven't replaced is the cam sensor......Oh Security system what can I do to check for that or reset????

The security system shuts power to the injectors. Use the noid light if it blinks the security system doesn't have you shut down. I use a analog DVOM and with the camshaft sensor disconnected the dial will sweep if cranking the engine the leads are connected to the wires from the sensor.
You also have a crankshaft sensor to check by the starter. This is on my 5.4L 2000 silverado.
As you say you have spark I would use a DVOM and make sure you have power to the injectors you have 8 like my 5.4L. Remember the computer completes the ground these pulses fire the injector. If you have a 12 volt test light use a paper clip and hook the ground for the light to the clamp and this way hook up to the wire while somebody cranks the engine, the test light should blink. A quick test on one will give you a lot of information

GGMurray,

Must be the year of the vehicle b/c I too have this problem (throughout the year) and just had an episode of my 2000 G1500 5.7v8 not starting.

Replaced the fuel filter in Nov., (PCV too). Traced out all the fuel pump, fuel supply relays, etc. The only thing that I can come up with is that the fuel pressure regulator (FPR)needs to be replaced. Tank is full of gas, the pump comes on, etc. The only thing I have not ruled out is the fuel pump pressure.

If it is the FPR, according to my Haynes manual, in order to replace the FPR, you have to take the intake system apart to gain access to it. THAT really sucks!!!!

Anyone else have any ideas???

Best of luck w/ your problem!!!

Oops! Forgot that my mechanic did test the fuel pressure and it was fine.....after he replaced the fuel filter. It was completely clogged/stopped up.

gkh,

Ya your right! lots of work to get to the FPR....make sure you put a gauge on it 1st, mine is running 64psi which according to what I read in the Haynes manual is pretty close 60 to 66psi. let me know how it turns out! good luck

I would love to get some of those GM engineers in a room for a few minutes. They should have to work on what they design and if they can't do it, then make the necessary changes!!!! ARGH!!!!!!

RH,

Thanks so much for all the help! I need to read up on the noid light, it's new to me...and AutoZone didn't have one or ORiley's...looks like I might have to order one from the website link you sent. Anyway thanks for the info on the Cam and crank sensor, I'll put my DVOM on it tomorrow. It's dark now...The test light...I'll read over it closer for better understanding, but I think you talking about testing the injectors right....without using the noid light....I have a test light, no problem....pull the electrical cover off the top of the injector housing right and check at any injector/or all of them. Will you be checking the forum tomorrow too?

RH,

New CPS intstalled but Cam sensor is original, do I need to worry about checking the new crank sensor

Any injector will do but if ording only one noid light look at your electrical connector first. The security system will shut down all of them.

Check injector first as you shouldn't have spark with a bad camshaft position sensor.
How much mileage is on the engine if over 100,000 you could have jumped time.

RH,

Ya your right, why spend time on the crank and cam sensor if I have spark......I'll work toward the power to the injectors 1st thing...Will test light be ok...Also the Spark...do you think it's ok if it's a redish kinda color??? I was holding the coil wire about 1/2 away from a copper wire I attached to the block....and had the spark, from there I took a plug wire off and stuck a sparkplug in the boot and held the plug to the exhaust manifold and you could see the spark there thus I figured it was ok...

RH,

104,000 miles, but running great!!! came home parked and got up the next morning and the rest is history!!

The older engines had a non metal covered top timing gear but I'm not sure on the newer engines. Hopefully somebody else will answer. The test light should work I imagine the injector will draw enough power to light a test light bulb.

RH,

Back at 100,000 I had to replace the intake manifold gaskets, it started leaking anti-freeze out the back of the manifold where you have to make the bridge out of silicone, but they were original anyway. One other trouble until now...I think I'll buy the hole kit of noid lights.

RH,

Maybe someone will know about the T gears, I sure hope it hasn't jumped time. What did you think about the P3351 code?

Personally timing gears are cheaper than going to the dealer for a theft shutdown. Ponchutty GM forum can help you if theft system is your problem. On the code I would have to look in my manual out in the garage.
Try putting it on TDC then pull number one plug use a small screw driver and make sure the piston is at the top. The valves have to be closed with the piston on the compression stroke. Use a hose from a compression tester to be certain you are on the compression stroke. You can feel the air coming out of the hose. This is after checking for power to the injector.

The easy way to do this is to get a scanner on the truck and look for cranking rpms, if good the cps is ok. As mentioned look for 12v to the injector circuit also.

Max,

Scanner is no problem, showing code P1351 right now, but I've looked over all the wiring and connectors...anyway how many RPM should I be looking for? or If it shows any rpm does that men the cps is ok

Max,

126 RPM according to scanner

Max,

That P1351 code = Manufacture Control Ignititon system or misfire....

Hey Everyone,

Update! Pulled the connector off the injectors and used my DVOM to check for 12V.....with the key in the on position I had 11.87 to 11.90 VDC on the terminals I checked in the plug any thoughts???? Also I guess the noid light tester plugs into a set of terminals on the plug which lights up when the injector is supose to fire.....

The computer completes the ground use a piece of small copper wire in one terminal hook the clamp on this wire put the metal tip into the other terminal. The security system tells the computer to shut down by not supplying the ground. You should have continous power supply which you do have at this time.
The bulb should flash when cranking.

RH,

I pulled the electrical boot off turned it over so I could get to the terminals and I used my DVOM. Here's how I hooked it up, I used a paper clip with a jumper wire clipped to it with one of my meter leads attached to it and the stuck it in side of the terminal and the other meter lead I clipped to the intake for a ground. What I got was milla Volts on one side of the terminal and the 11.9 volts on the other, which was the same for all of them, With the key on...had to order a noid light, couldn't find one anywhere in town today......also going to order an ignition tester too....so I know I have the correct amount of fire...

RH,

I gotta have a noid light right, In order to verify the power to the injector...

RH,

I'm building a pretty long thread on this, is it OK? 2 pages now

You will eventually find the problem just keep working. At lease you are willing to buy test equipment.

RH,

Stuff's on the way! This time the van's not going to the shop!!! Thanks so very much for all the help!!! You know the ole saying, if at first you don't suceed try, try again!!!

Heres some information for you.
http://www.asashop.org/autoinc/feb97/techtips.htm
http://sbftech.com/index.php/topic,588.0.html Look at pictures mostly Ford but look at using a 12 volt test light as noid light.

RH,

Thanks for the info, The first article seemed alot like what I'm dealing with...they ended up finding some melted wires in the harness....but learned to check at the ECM first...That second one was good too, it seems that using starting fluid is a common way to check if it's a fuel or ignition problem, I was kinda worried about using the spray!!!

If your going into the harness buy a wiring diagram.
http://www.alldata.com/ sells a years subscription for $26.95
As it shows a picture of a plug by using a copper wire you can have somebody hold at computer terminal and you can check each injector plug. Then unplug one end and check to ground.
If your going to solder in a resister it will show what two wires to use. Then you have to retrain BCM. Radio shack has resisters or you can buy a new key switch from the dealer.

RH,

Niod lights will be here 10 am tomorrow on UPS, quick as I get my hands on them I'll test the injector plug

RH,

If I did jump time.....Pull #1 plug out and run it up TDC and check the line-up on the timing marks, or look to see if it's pointing at #1 on the dist. I'

RH,

If I did jump time.....Pull #1 plug out and run it up TDC and check the line-up on the timing marks, or look to see if it's pointing at #1 on the dist. I'

http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=51302

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=881442

If you have a distributor roll it over by hand appx. 60 degrees beyond TDC then roll it back to zero. With the distributor cap off use whiteout and mark the distributor base where the tip of the rotor is then have somebody watch the rotor turn slowly until the rotor just starts to move. Look at the timing mark and if it moved over appx.20 degrees it can cause a no start.
I did edit a previous post if you don't have a distributor. Basically No.1 has to be in compression with both valves closed. Use a compression tester hose and stop when you feel air. Roll to TDC and make sure both valves are closed.
MT had good pictures for guidelines.
What your looking for is stretch in the timing chain.

As rhandwor posted is a good check.
Also a true timing chain time check when no one cylinder is TDC compression or right at the time it is going to and over TDC the valves on your opsite firing cylinder no 6 should be rocking.
One closing and one opening.
If not the timing chain is out of time.

Since your working on checking timing does this mean the noid light flashed as it should?

Hey MT and RH

Sorry for the delay...Here's the latest!....As you know I had the Noid lights comming UPS around 10am, and also an ignition tester too...so I had a little time before UPS ran so I decided to look try the starting fluid one more time, this time not just a shot in the TH Body but prop it open some and crank and spray to see what would happen...oh almost forgot I unplugged the fuel pump relay because I thought if the gas was contaminated it mess me up with the starting fluid, make sense to you guys? Anyway in a nut shell I got the same results.....Nothing....

Hey RH and MT

Well after the starting fluid, I checked over the wiring again, but this time went under the van to the passager side looking around for anything that might be a clue..And I found that the harness leading down to the CPS, and O2 sensor had cracked deteriorated wire loom and as it passed into the the heat shield "I guess" it was like a covering over the loom, anyway it was it was just pieces and also full of water....so of course I pulled it all apart looking for a short but couldn't find anything that looked bad, so I went up to the parts house got some loom and also a new rotor....I was worried that the contact bar may have worn "It really was fine".....I wish I could post some pics of all this......is there a way??

RH,MT

Alright so this is where it gets tricky......I made it back from Parts and Service, made the repair on the wiring harness "got some pics for everyone" and I was finishing up when UPS pulled in!!!! So of course I wanted to check out the lights, there cool!! just what I needed!! So from there, sense the dist. was easy to get to, I changed the rotor first before I got into the injector plug....Oh plugged in the fuel pump relay too...AND!!! turned the key and it spit and sputtered and died......hummm, AND again.......Spit sputter and now I'm running......hummm,

MT,RH

It had to be the rotor I thought.....NO WAY!!, "You guys know how it is when it mysteriously starts working" I needed to know what, I did!!! So started going back though would I did, first the rotor, I put the old one back on....and tried it...fired right up....I wiggled the harness and pulled on the harness tried it and no problem fired right up....Got brave and went for a test drive, runs fine......I don't know what happened........Also checked the scanner and cleared the P1351 code and checked it again and computer passes the scanner tests....I don't know what to do now....In my opinion I think it's just a matter of time before it lets me down again....

RH,MT

You know all of us worked really worked hard on this and I really appreciate all of your guidance, This truly is a fantastic site with top notch members!! I wish I could tell you guys that "This was the problem" where we could all be satisfied, but on the side I know that when I have a problem again maybe we can pickup where we left off....OR if you have an idea of what I could check PLEASE let me know I'd be glad to try it. I'm going to try and figure out how to post these pics, I think they may help someone else down the line..

RH, MT

Any chance either of you know how to add pics...

I think you were fortunate that you found the wiring problem and fixed it before you really had a problem. I think either you had some corriosion of some kind on the push button in the distributor cap. I've also had the spring under the push button get weak, or sticking and not make good contact. Otherwise the new rotor would have worked. If you have a problem in the future this is where I would start looking. I would make sure the coil wire is plugged in good in the dist. cap.
I was pleased you didn't give up this will allow you to make a lot of progress.
I don't know how to send pictures.

RH,

Thanks again for all the help the past couple of day.

If you don't get results you could google photo service and use a service like
http://www.snapfish.com/ Then post a link. I don't know the cost but get items from relatives from these services.