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94 Lumina 3.1 cranks - won't start


Tinman238
01-06-2008, 02:50 PM
94 Lumina 3.1 died while going around a slow corner in a parking garage, then cranked but would not start. Had it towed home and checked fuel pressure: 44 psi while cranking. The engine will try to fire sometimes but won't quite get there. Are there any known crank trigger issues with these engines? The car has 82,000 actual miles (got it from a relative who bought it new). I read quite a few posts and this seems to be a relativley common problem. I am thinking that there is a recurring issue that causes the engine to die and then not restart. If anyone has found a fix for this, please post it, or any ideas. If no one knows, I will post the cure when I find it.

By the way, I did check for codes and only got repeating 12's, so there are no codes to reference.

j cAT
01-06-2008, 03:53 PM
94 Lumina 3.1 died while going around a slow corner in a parking garage, then cranked but would not start. Had it towed home and checked fuel pressure: 44 psi while cranking. The engine will try to fire sometimes but won't quite get there. Are there any known crank trigger issues with these engines? The car has 82,000 actual miles (got it from a relative who bought it new). I read quite a few posts and this seems to be a relativley common problem. I am thinking that there is a recurring issue that causes the engine to die and then not restart. If anyone has found a fix for this, please post it, or any ideas. If no one knows, I will post the cure when I find it.

By the way, I did check for codes and only got repeating 12's, so there are no codes to reference.
check for spark at all plugs , no spark check for voltage to coil. check crank position sensor resistance 2-3,000ohms all pcm wiring and sensor wires/connectors. crank sensor my guess ran fine suddenly died, no codes.............

Blue Bowtie
01-06-2008, 05:26 PM
A '12' is the code for no ignition reference pulse. It doesn't mean that the system is in diagnostic mode, as most web sites erroneously report.

Tinman238
01-06-2008, 05:43 PM
The "12" code makes sense then.

Tkaynk
01-08-2008, 01:46 PM
Good luck, I had this happen in Oct 2007 and still have not been able to repair it. I bought another car. I work at a repair shop, and they worked on it for two months, and then passed it to my family in which I have three mechanics, and still nothing. There is a thread on here somewhere of all that has been changed, put about $400 into it and nothing, so please if you find something, post it.

Tinman238
01-08-2008, 03:12 PM
Follow up on the problem:

Checked for spark - good spark. Checked the plugs - extremely worn, they look like the originals. I changed them with new AC Delco's. Still no start. Changed the crankshaft position sensor because they're cheap. Still no start. Sprayed starting fluid in the intake hose while my son cranked it - it ran! (only did it for a second to avoid damage).

Also, a little more background on the car. I got it from my mother in-law about a month ago. She bought it new. The car is in excellent shape but I don't think she did much in the way of maintenance on it. She was....thrifty, yea, that's it......thrifty.

At this point:

Good spark at the right time - will run on starting fluid
New plugs (needed them severely)
New crankshaft position sensor (didn't need it)
Good fuel pressure (44 psi)
Air filter was new 500 miles ago

Any ideas out there?

16th hippy
01-08-2008, 08:32 PM
if will run on starting fluid, it seems to be more of a fuel problem. check entire system, plugged filter can give pressure reading, but not enough volume to run engine. relay could be bad, extreme high resistance in wiring to fuel pump, and the list goes on. would do a full fuel system diag and go from there.

Blue Bowtie
01-08-2008, 10:10 PM
If you are reading 44 PSIG (3 BAR) while cranking, fuel pressure is more than adequate. Check for fuel injector 12V power supply with the ignition on. There should be 12V present on one side of the injectors. Also check for injector pulses while cranking.

Tinman238
01-09-2008, 04:56 PM
Replaced the fuel filter - needed it anyway.

Popped an injector plug off and checked for power. With the ignition on, I have 12 volts at the connector with the orange w black stripe wire. Also checked with a test light and have a strong, steady light. Connector with the purple wire had about 3.5 volts initially, then couldn't get a reading from my digital VOM. With the test light, I have a steady, dim light.

Checked with the engine cranking and nothing changed. Strong, steady light on one side and dim, steady light on the other side. I can detect no pulsing signal to the injectors with the engine cranking.

j cAT
01-09-2008, 07:08 PM
Replaced the fuel filter - needed it anyway.

Popped an injector plug off and checked for power. With the ignition on, I have 12 volts at the connector with the orange w black stripe wire. Also checked with a test light and have a strong, steady light. Connector with the purple wire had about 3.5 volts initially, then couldn't get a reading from my digital VOM. With the test light, I have a steady, dim light.

Checked with the engine cranking and nothing changed. Strong, steady light on one side and dim, steady light on the other side. I can detect no pulsing signal to the injectors with the engine cranking.


one side of injector is always 12v to ground the other side of injector coil goes to pcm where it is grounded as required. so if a meter is on pcm side of injector it should pulse. if on 12volt side it will stay solid 12v.
possible MAF is bad. disconnect MAF connector if it starts maf is probably n/g. next maybe egr is stuck open this would cause it to stall quickly as no air would get to intake.
use meter and check all fuses ..............

Rub_Dr
01-21-2008, 01:36 PM
Have you checked the fuel pressure regulator? It could be stuck and sending the fuel straight back to the tank.......just a thought!

Tinman238
01-21-2008, 06:21 PM
I actually have it running now. Took the ignition module off and had it checked - checks fine. Replaced the coolant temp sensor with no change. Plug wires had several arc spots on them, so they're new now. Replaced the ECM and it runs - badly. Have to hold the throttle down to get it to start. Will run but RPM's are all over the place. Sometimes it will idle, sometimes it won't. Lots of backfireing. I'm going to change intake manifold gaskets now since I want to fix the oil leak from the distributor plug under the manifold anyway. I'll check carefully for gasket condition and I'll be checking all possible sources of intake leaks. Once I get these things done, I'll get back with an update.

I don't think its the regulator, but once I get it together, I'll check it out.

I'm still wide open for ideas. Keep 'em coming.

j cAT
01-21-2008, 06:59 PM
I'm still wide open for ideas. Keep 'em coming.[/quote]

remove egr valve plug up holes and see if it starts and idles better. just for short test......

Rub_Dr
01-22-2008, 12:47 AM
Hey your reply set off a lightbulb. Sounds similar to what mine did b4 it just gave up. After 2 yrs of tinkering on it in my spare time it ended up being the wiring was shorted from the crank sensor to the control module. A cheap way to check that, go find one in a junk yard that still has both connectors and make a new 1 you can loop under the car and plug in. Most of the junk yards will just give you the connectors or at least they do here where im at.

At least mine is running OK for now.. just need to clean the rats nest out of the duct work so i have heat again :rolleyes:

Tinman238
01-22-2008, 04:33 AM
I'm still wide open for ideas. Keep 'em coming.

remove egr valve plug up holes and see if it starts and idles better. just for short test......[/quote]

Excellent idea. I forgot to mention that I did that with no change. Thanks.

Tinman238
01-22-2008, 04:34 AM
Hey your reply set off a lightbulb. Sounds similar to what mine did b4 it just gave up. After 2 yrs of tinkering on it in my spare time it ended up being the wiring was shorted from the crank sensor to the control module. A cheap way to check that, go find one in a junk yard that still has both connectors and make a new 1 you can loop under the car and plug in. Most of the junk yards will just give you the connectors or at least they do here where im at.

At least mine is running OK for now.. just need to clean the rats nest out of the duct work so i have heat again :rolleyes:

I'm beginning to suspect wiring more and more. I will definitley check the wiring out. Thanks.

luv my lumina
03-20-2008, 06:09 AM
similar problems here...replaced plugs and all things ya'll listed...ended up being busted timing chain.....maybe worth checking out eh?

Bearwulf
03-23-2008, 01:02 AM
A '12' is the code for no ignition reference pulse. It doesn't mean that the system is in diagnostic mode, as most web sites erroneously report.

Then maybe you should inform GM about this as they state in their manuals as well as @ the shops that this is the indication of whether or not the ALDL is working.

Manowarr
03-25-2008, 03:23 PM
This happened to my 92 lumina 3.1L V6. It would crank over but wouldn't start. They replaced a couple of coil packs and the crank sensor and it started fine after that.

Tinman238
03-25-2008, 07:31 PM
Thanks for the input. Verified the timing chain is fine, checked ignition module, coils, new plugs and wires, new intake manifold gaskets, fuel injectors verified OK, new ECM, O2 sensor, crank sensor, fuel filter, etc. Seems to be that the ignition circuit is not getting consistent power. I'm thinking now that it could be something in the ignition switch or wires in the steering column. I bought a Tahoe cause I needed something that ran. Hopefully I'll work on the Lumina again in a week or so.

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