hey,

i was just wondering has anyone notice holden now 4wd... i think its called the cruze... anyway... this si not my point

the point is with all this new 4wd technoligy holden is getting into, its makes me think there not far any from copying something similar to the skyline or even lancer/subaru theme that most japaese car companies have made famous

could this be the end of the grunty 300kW v8 RWD...?!?

i'd like to hear others opinions on this topic

Sorry to burst your bubble there....

The Cruze (sold as a Chevrolet elsewhere) is just a Suzuki/GM joint-venture car. It doesn't have any 4wd technology that hasn't been floating around for many years. And it definitely isn't the technology needed to move up to a Lancer EVO or Impreza WRX competitor. It's just an economy car/truck.

http://www.holden.com.au/app/gmbp/au/en/gmbp/gmbp/homepage

i think you should check this out hudson... apparently the car manufacturere says there AWD's... so i think i'd beleive them

so should you...:D

Hudson, you are right about all but one thing- the Cruze is mainly sold as a Suzuki.

And Jimbo, the Cruze is a one model line-up (At least it will be when it comes here) and the only model is AWD, in other places AWD is an option (Or so the car-rag's tell me)

Can't argue with NZ$25,000 though :D

moss...

i wasnt referring to the product line... in fact i never mentioned it, i was mearly stating that there seems to be a growing trend in making AWD vehicles at the moment...

i also asked whether it is holdens intention to bring AWD to most if not all of its product line-up...

you also have to remember that when seatbelts fiest came out they were options...

Originally posted by Jimbo_Jones
moss...

i wasnt referring to the product line... in fact i never mentioned it, i was mearly stating that there seems to be a growing trend in making AWD vehicles at the moment...

i also asked whether it is holdens intention to bring AWD to most if not all of its product line-up...

you also have to remember that when seatbelts fiest came out they were options...

OK point taken.

But unless Opel/Vauxhall adds AWD to it's European lineup, then I doubt that AWD will find it's way onto many Holdens.....................

Any word on the AWD Commodore's and Falcons of late????

Originally posted by Jimbo_Jones
http://www.holden.com.au/app/gmbp/au/en/gmbp/gmbp/homepage

i think you should check this out hudson... apparently the car manufacturere says there AWD's... so i think i'd beleive them

so should you...:D

I never said it wasn't AWD. All I said was that it didn't have anything that wasn't offered elsewhere for quite sometime. Suzuki has been making AWD cars for many years and the Cruze is just a modified Suzuki product. That's all I was referring to.

i was asking for opinions about whether this type of technology was going to be used in future product-lines made by holden, hudson you should really read the question before you decide to answer, so far anything you've said has been based on a mis-conception of the thread topic...

FYI i wasnt referring to the cruze being a competitor for the lancer/suburu... and where the heck did ya get that from anywayz?

Sigh...

My opinion is that we'll probably see an AWD derivative of both the Falcon and the Commodore probably in the next 5 years. It will be a cross-over vehicle - something a bit like a Subie Forester or a BMW X5.
Before everyone leaps in... this mean a AWD urban vehicle based on a monocoque passenger chassis.

I don't see AWD being used in future versions of an SS or an XR8 - maybe in something in a HSV GTO or a Tickford GT Falcon in very small batches - and almost definitely not across the line.

AWD adds cost, complexity, reduces power (due to drag and powertrain losses) and reduces fuel economy. Also your average Falcodore driver seems to prefer rear-wheel drive handling characteristics rather than AWD which feels a lot like a front-driver. Besides in the dry on Tarmac there isn't a whole lot to be gained in driving the front wheels for most Falc/Commo drivers anyway - both have perfectly adequate suspensions for most drivers. In the wet and off road, there are gains but just how many AWD SUVS hit the bush instead of gleaming in someone's urban driveway?

The only way I see AWD being available across the line is if (and this is a big if) either the Commodore or Falcon inherits front-wheel drive from someone else's platform. Given the Sigma Platform development at GM I can't see it - although if they don't the Barra Falcon falls flat then it could happen in which case a FWD platform like Taurus (please save us if this happens) could be the basis of a future Falcon. In which case, I'd imagine Ford Aust trying to do a Jaguar X-Type and sending some drive to the back...

THANKYOU...

congratualtions replicant you are the first one to actually answer the thread correctly... thanks for sharing your opinion,

i see you've heard about the BA Falcon?

i was wondering if you have heard about them could you please describe the (apparently) most powerful 6 cylinders, it seems to be very elusive as i can find no information on the net, is it acually a inline or a V? and how and why is it so powerful?

thanks

Ford have not released any official details on the drivetrain package for the Barra Falcon.

The current view is that the base engine will be a makeover of the current inline six. The current inline six is an single overhead cam design with variable valve timing in the XR6 and in the Fairmont Ghia. Displacing 4.0 litres it got considerable development funds in the AU Falcon program so I can't see it being ditched - and there isn't any alternative as cheap or with the torque characteristics anywhere in the Ford empire

I'd expect to see the variable valve timing possibly carried to all versions, revised engine mapping and possibly either a DOHC variant or a supercharger - though this is unlikely.

The V8 engines will probably be from the Ford Modular family probably SOHC 5.4 litres with more powerful versions for XR and Tickford variants

-----------
Quote Replicant:

possibly either a DOHC variant or a supercharger
-----------

i doubt the supercharger would be optioned as it would be to close to what holden is offering

i've seen pictures of the BA, i think its looks just like some of its predecssors...but i cant wait to get engine specs if its as good as they say it is...

One rumor was it coud be a turbocharger (possibly for XR6 duty)... That would provide a lot of torque too.

The engine is supposed to be oversquare - instead of the long stroke undersquare dimensions that it is now. That would suit the DOHC conversion and make forced induction very attractive. The only trade off is some low down torque so a hair-dryer would be useful especially for mid-range torque. And 4 valves at high revs, variable valve timing, variable induction length and some boost would be great!!!

i (personally) dont think that the turbocharger is such a good idea considering fords target audience, most of them are petrol heads who lived through the mustang/torana/monaro (others i have neglected to mention) era... i severely doubt that any model involving a turbocharger would be popular... i could be wrong

seeing the success of the supercharger attached to holdens v6's i'd say that fords is looking into that department... (but who really knows?? fords design team i'd say)

i also dont see fords people having to live with turbo lag (i hate turbo lag, even tho i dont own a turbo'd car)...

Originally posted by Jimbo_Jones
-----------
Quote Replicant:

possibly either a DOHC variant or a supercharger
-----------

i doubt the supercharger would be optioned as it would be to close to what holden is offering

i've seen pictures of the BA, i think its looks just like some of its predecssors...but i cant wait to get engine specs if its as good as they say it is...


The BA Falcon is frickin awful, time for it to lay down and let the Mondeo take the fleet market- It should just be offered in Fairmont Ghia and Tickford forms :mad: :mad: :mad:

lets get this straight.... all falcons are f**kin awful

:D *waiting for flaming*

Ha

pouring gasoline on the fire....

have to admit I bought a Mondeo ST because I couldn't stand the sight
of the XR6 that parks next to my spot in basement. And because it is
a much much nicer car to drive - especially in terms of the interior and features.

on the other hand I don't especially think the VX is one of the better
facelifts - I preferred the grille and rear end treatment on the VT to be
honest - and the R8 Clubsport rear valance looks like someone forgot
to finish the moulds properly at HSV.

But I do like the Monaro - apart from the grille on the HSV versions. the front spoiler has some excellent surface detailing though

Originally posted by replicant_008
Ha

pouring gasoline on the fire....

have to admit I bought a Mondeo ST because I couldn't stand the sight
of the XR6 that parks next to my spot in basement. And because it is
a much much nicer car to drive - especially in terms of the interior and features.

on the other hand I don't especially think the VX is one of the better
facelifts - I preferred the grille and rear end treatment on the VT to be
honest - and the R8 Clubsport rear valance looks like someone forgot
to finish the moulds properly at HSV.

But I do like the Monaro - apart from the grille on the HSV versions. the front spoiler has some excellent surface detailing though
Amen on the topic of Commodore and Monaro, I think the VT was definitley the better one, BUT HSV don't know shit about making bodykits, they have so far uglified every Commodore over the 15 years they have been going :mad: :mad:

Good choice on buying the Mondeo too, my Mum is condiering trading her Civic (2001 VTi-S) for a Zetec hatch whent he company tells her time to trade on up (or down :D )

personally i like the VX SS, but thats just me