Hi there,

My dad bought a 2002 XLE, it's only got 30,000 miles. It's been through two sets of rotors, and I'm ready to replace them again. My first question is: Why are they warping so quickly?

My second question is: Do I have to know anything special to replace the pads and rotors on this anti lock system? Do I have to worry about disableing my anti lock system by disconnecting the wrong thing? Or maybe I have to unhook the battery cable? I never did anti lock before, and I was told it was tricky.

Thanks in advance.

Antilock brakes do not present any additional problems when doing brake and/or rotor replacement. You don't need to disconnect the battery.

As far as the rotors warping, I would check to see if a caliper is sticking and causing constant brake pressure on one of the rotors. Jack up the car at each wheel and try to sping the wheel by hand. Is one noticeably harder to spin than the others. If it is, inspect that caliper for a sticking piston and check to see if the slide pins are sticking. Repair or replace as necessary.

Also, have the pads been replaced? If so what type of pad (organic, semi-metalic or ceramic) was used? Some pads are just so hard they warp the rotors.

Mike

Also check to see if your Dad is a two footed driver (right foot gas, left foot brake). I couldn't figure out why my Mother-in-Law kept having problems with her brake pads cracking and warped rotors on her 98 Camry LE. Then, one day I watched her drive from the passenger seat. She was using the brake pedal as a foot stool for her left foot. She was keeping just enough pressure on the brake to keep the brake lights on and the brakes slightly engaged. That also explained why her brake lights burned out abnormally fast, too.

She still drives that way, because I've found you can't change an 80 year old's habits. But, now we know why she has to replace the brakes around every 3000 to 4000 miles (for her, about every six months).

Well thanks for the great info. Kinda fast too...

Anyway, my mother is a two-footed driver. I have tried to "suggest" to her that that's the problem, but they won't believe it if I tell them. So this is highly suspect.

The brake pads are ceramic, which I agree, might be the culprit. I am replacing them with pure organic this time.

I will jack it up and check to see if anything is hanging up... ie calipers. I read your other thread about the caliper pulling on one side. Sounds intrigueing.

Thanks again, I'll let you know what happens.

My dad bought a 2002 XLE, it's only got 30,000 miles. It's been through two sets of rotors, and I'm ready to replace them again. My first question is: Why are they warping so quickly?

Either the rotors suck, or he's using them incorrectly.
Light braking should be used for the first 1,000 miles. There is NO brake rotor EM that recommends less than a 1,000 mile break in. That means no hard braking, no medium braking for 1,000 miles.

Rotors become hot from the wheel temperature, while can exceed 1,000*F under heavy braking. You should not drive, then wash the car even romotely soon, or run through puddles of water. Water will rapidly cool the rotors.

Understand that rotors warp one of two ways:
1) pure overheating
2) extreme heating & cooling cycles

So you've got a tossup between he doesn't know how to drive & break in rotors, or you're buying crappy rotors. Odds are on he doesn't know how to drive.


My second question is: Do I have to know anything special to replace the pads and rotors on this anti lock system? Do I have to worry about disableing my anti lock system by disconnecting the wrong thing? Or maybe I have to unhook the battery cable? I never did anti lock before, and I was told it was tricky.

Don't hit the wheel speed sensors, or pull the wire as they're fragile.
No. There is no difference when working on an ABS system. They bleed the same way.

On the other hand... I personally drove this car to Florida once, and the rotors got progressively worse as I drove it... So maybe mom didn't do it.

Here's a couple interesting articles on brake linings:

http://www.babcox.com/editorial/ic/ic20316.htm
http://www.asashop.org/autoinc/nov2002/mech.cfm

Rotor problems:

http://www.performanceoiltechnology.com/brakingsystems.htm

Ok, so I finally got the rotors from Advance Auto, I had them backordered at Auto Zone and they never came. Advance had Bendix, so I got them. They were supposed to be the best quality. The pads were Bendix pure organic. So I know I got soft pads with good rotors. Now we will see what happens after one year. I'm pretty sure it's mom doing it, and I can't change here ways. I told dad I'll just replace the rotors every year.

One thing I found was that one of the wear indicator clips on the pads was missing. Do you think it is possible this could have been the problem?

Anyway, thanks for all the great help everyone. Nice articles, Brian R.

If this doesn't fix it, you will have to troubleshoot the braking system. In that case, you probably have a faulty braking system that is not relieving the pressure from the pads when the brakes aren't applied.

Missing the wear indicator will not cause this. Since you had the same problem on a trip, I doubt it's Mom.

Make sure you break them in carefully for at least a week - be gentle.

OK, eight months have passed, and the rotors are warped AGAIN! Mom didn't drive the car this time. So I'm thinking it's sticking calipers. I'll have to ride down to Florida to check it out. I'll keep you posted.

Sorry for adding to this thread, I thought it was necessary to update for future reference it as there is more information now and it takes months to get a fix on how repairs made out.

In September 2007 I finally removed the rotors after about 40,000 miles and had them "cut". It was smooth as could be initially, but now at 44,000 they need to be cut again, or it's at least getting noticeable.

So that makes at least FOUR time the rotors were redone that I know about. We got this car at about 15,000 so I don't know about before then. I'm ready to do the FIFTH time now. So it's now January 2008.

When you have the front rotors resurfaced, also readjust the rear brakes. If they are not helping to stop the car, then the front brakes do all the work, causing excessive heat build-up and subsequent warpage. Just went through this on my '92, though I have rear drum brakes.

If the front brakes are not releasing fully, then the caliper pistons are hanging up in the bores. If it is very difficult to compress the caliper piston back into the bore with a c-clamp, then it is bad. It should resist, but not hard. New calipers are cheaper, faster, and easier than a repair kit. Flush and bleed the brakes while your at it...if the fluid is brown or murky, its time to change it.

Alternatively, if you have rear disc brakes, then the rear calipers may have air in the lines, preventing their proper function and diminishing their effectiveness. Flush and bleed as mentioned above.

It's rare that both sides would be bad at once, but if the fluid has gone bad and absorbed enough water, internal corrosion can cause this too. With one bad caliper, the car will pull to one side or the other as the brake is depressed.

Actually, the calipers on this car are in about as good shape as they get. The pistons move freely in when replacing the pads. Everything is nice and clean under there like a almost new car, this car has an easy life for sure.

Interesting theory about air in the lines causing the rear calipers to not work properly. Pedal is firm, brakes seem to work fine when rotors are true.

The other interesting thing is that I notice the rotors get out of true what seems like perfectly symmetrically, that's to say they get out of true equally.

I was thinking of replacing the master cyliner, as this would cover all the bases as far as making sure the fronts and the rears are working equally well, thus it would also force a complete bleed job too.

My only other thoughts are the caliper slide pins need grease or replacing and MAYBE there's a front/rear proportioning valve that isn't working right...I'm guessing on the last since I don't have access to manuals for the '02.

Another idea is to find an infrared thermometer and measure each rotor's temperature after a typical drive. An abnormally low rear temp will signal poor rear engagement. They may not be as hot as the fronts, but they should be up there.

Ok, thanks for the info, I'll think about the front/back regulator. And rotor temperature.

Update:

My Dad took it to the mechanic, the guy said he thought the REAR rotors were warped, and that was causing the fronts to warp. He turned the rear rotors cheaply, and it seems better. We'll see if that works, I let you know how it turns out.

Update:

My Dad took it to the mechanic, the guy said he thought the REAR rotors were warped, and that was causing the fronts to warp. He turned the rear rotors cheaply, and it seems better. We'll see if that works, I let you know how it turns out.


What's the update? My 2002 was going through front rotors too but it is an LE with rear drums. I had the rotors turned and they quickly warped again. Made sure everything was lubed when I changed the pads and reinstalled the rotors. There was only one problem rotor. After having them turned I placed it on the driver side (it was originally on the passenger side). The same rotor warped again so I am guessing it was a defect but not positive. I replaced them with a set from Napa and installed quality Hawk ceramic pads. They seem to be holding up so far.... I have read this on other forums concerning the 2002 model.

Well, it looks like the REAR rotors were the culprit! The theory is that because the REAR rotors were warped, they caused the FRONT rotors to wear bad. Ever since my Dad had the REAR rotors turned, the problem had disappeared.

If the rear drum brakes are not adjusted properly, then all of the braking force is provided by the front rotors, causing excessive heat buildup, thus warping. Not to say they could have been warped, too. It is a common problem with nearly every vehicle I've owned with rear drum brakes...the "Self-adjusting" mechanism rarely works even after I clean & lube it to death. They should be adjusted along with every oil change IMO.

If the rear drum brakes are not adjusted properly, then all of the braking force is provided by the front rotors, causing excessive heat buildup, thus warping. Not to say they could have been warped, too. It is a common problem with nearly every vehicle I've owned with rear drum brakes...the "Self-adjusting" mechanism rarely works even after I clean & lube it to death. They should be adjusted along with every oil change IMO.

This is a good example of why everyone should first consider a vehicle with 4-wheel discs. They are way superior to rear drums.