97 Trans Sport Head Removal ! Need Help !

I just bought a 97 Transport with the 3.4 L engine ...This is the first time I have worked on one ... I have done lots of work on the 5.7 L engines ...I knew the Trans Sport engine needed work when I bought it ... A compression test showed NO compression on #4 cylinder ...Right in front ! OH BOY EASY I THOUGHT ! Both valves on that cylinder are free so it is not a stuck valve... I figure burned valve or bad valve seat ...I already removed the passenger side strut mount on the engine that was a real stinker to get off because the Haines manual does not mention that two of the air conditioner compressor bolts go through this mount and you must remove them Also to get it off ! The Haines manual shows only two bolts ! The other two are hidden down there horizontal in the air conditioner compressor top !

I have some questions I could sure use some help with ...

#1....... What do I need to remove to get the front (left head off )

#2....... Should I use the old head bolts again ? I worked on a lot of Escorts and they say NEVER use the old bolts However My Haines manual on the Trans Sport does not say ?

#3 ....... Any suggestions about things I can re-use ? Or that I should replace while I have this all Apart ?


THANK YOU ! BOB IN CASSOPOLIS MICHIGAN :)

#1 - You will have to take the intake manifold off. There are numerous threads in this and sister vehicle forums on what this takes. You would also be very foolish not to do the rear one as well. The cost isn't that much more and the rear head around cylinder 1 has a tendency to leak as well. When I did my 98 Trans Sport, the Haynes manual was pretty accurate for what needed to come off so follow that. You will probably want to have the heads resurfaced as well as cleaned up/degreased/devarnished in addition to fixing the compression issue.

#2 - You can reuse the head bolts. They are TTY but not stretch bolts. You can buy the head set at the dealer for $100 if you want, but isn't necessary. The intake manifold bolts are recommended as they were "redesigned", but most people will probably tell you that thy just have a new lock-tite preapplied to them.

#3 - You are going to need new head gaskets and probably want to replace the exhaust manifold gaskets. For the heads that is about it other then studs/nuts/bolts that you might break off. The intake manifold will be a new upper and lower gasket set, bypass pipe o-ring, oil pump drive shaft o-ring, coolant pipe o-ring (attaches to t-stat housing), t-stat, plugs. Most of this stuff isn't "necessary" to be replaced, but they cost relatively little for what is required to replace them if they go bad. New gaskets are absolutely required though as they have been redesigned. Other things that you may want to get new is plug wires, temp sensor, and O2 sensor. These all cost a little more and aren't that hard to replace, but they are very accessible when you have the engine tore down. Everything else I think you can reuse. You can also replace your heater hoses (or at least the clamps) while you have easy access to them. If you ever have to replace a hose with the engine assembled, you will be thankful.

Check this (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=372853&page=1&pp=15&highlight=overheating) thread from when I did my heads for some tips regarding the heads as well as the intake manifold.

I was under the impression that they were TTY bolts and should not be reused. The extra 90 degrees after torquing streches the bolt.

I was under the impression that they were TTY bolts and should not be reused. The extra 90 degrees after torquing streches the bolt.I was under the same impression, but apparently not. I beleive they are technically just angle torqued and not truly TTY. This (http://www.pbase.com/stealthfti/hb) page talks about the differences. While it's actually regarding Volvos, the same concept applies for our vehicles. The key concept is whether or not our bolts actually yield or strech beyond the point of elastisity when tightened. All bolts strech some by designed. The key point is how much they stretch before they return back to their normal size. My Haynes manual nor my shop manual mention nothing of replaceing or not reusing the bolts.

If all else fails, follow what the shops do. Both of the largest GM dealerships in my town of 300k don't even regularly stock them and they said they do heads on the 3400 on a near daily basis. If they indeed do them on a daily basis which I have no doubt they do, don't you think that they would stock them like they would intake gaskets and it's bolts?

When I did mine, I opted not to sped the extra $125+ for a new bolt set as I couldn't find any compelling evidence in any of my manuals or shops that I called that said you have to. I chose to ignore the lady at one parts counter that said "Well I think you might have to but I would have to talk to someone who knows to tell you for sure". I reused my old ones and after 5000 miles and 3 or 4 months, no problems yet knock on wood.

:biggrin: THANK YOU SO MUCH ! for the information CDRU and everyone...I Have already decided to do both heads and to go ahead and re-use the bolts ... I will know when I tighten them if they stretch you can feel it on the ones that do ...I just bought a new gasket set at the ZONE and am still having STICKER SHOCK ! 115 bucks ! WOW ! I broke off one exhaust manifold bolt ...I think it was weak because I was using a 1/4 inch ratchet and hardly had any pressure on it ... I found that PB-BLASTER works great to get those Manifold bolts out I wiggle the bolt back and forth a tiny bit with my 1/4 ratchet then squirt on some BLASTER then work it back and forth some more to loosen it and out it comes ! no problem great stuff ! I will get back on here when the job is done and let all of you know how it comes out ...Thanks Again ! ...SLOW AND EASY !!! Bob in Cassopolis MICHIGAN ...

:biggrin: THANK YOU SO MUCH ! for the information CDRU and everyone...I Have already decided to do both heads and to go ahead and re-use the bolts ... I will know when I tighten them if they stretch you can feel it on the ones that do ...I just bought a new gasket set at the ZONE and am still having STICKER SHOCK ! 115 bucks !Run, don't walk back to the Zone and return it. You are going to want to get OEM parts for this. Aftermarket parts many people have found out will give you problems. I don't know specifically about the head gaskets, but the intake gaskets have been redesigned several times to prevent the intake manifold coolant leak. I, like you, went the cheaper aftermarket route for the gaskets the first time my intake was leaking. I ended up redoing it less then 6 months later as the leak returned. Trust me, you don't want to have to take the intake manifold off more times then you half to. I want to say the head gaskets were in the neighborhood of $30 each, the exhaust manifold gaskets $15 each, and the intake set around $60. The EGR and valve cover gaskets are the only other gaskets that I can think of. The valve cover gaskets can be easily reused if they are in good condition still (put a little dab of RTV in the notch where the manifold meets the heads...you'll see where). The EGR gaskets can be gotten aftermarket for a few bucks without issue.

Run, don't walk back to the Zone and return it. You are going to want to get OEM parts for this. Aftermarket parts many people have found out will give you problems. I don't know specifically about the head gaskets, but the intake gaskets have been redesigned several times to prevent the intake manifold coolant leak. I, like you, went the cheaper aftermarket route for the gaskets the first time my intake was leaking. I ended up redoing it less then 6 months later as the leak returned. Trust me, you don't want to have to take the intake manifold off more times then you half to. I want to say the head gaskets were in the neighborhood of $30 each, the exhaust manifold gaskets $15 each, and the intake set around $60. The EGR and valve cover gaskets are the only other gaskets that I can think of. The valve cover gaskets can be easily reused if they are in good condition still (put a little dab of RTV in the notch where the manifold meets the heads...you'll see where). The EGR gaskets can be gotten aftermarket for a few bucks without issue.

THANKS AGAIN CDRU I Have not opened the box with the Gaskets so I will take them BACK ! ASAP .... I am also going to get a Rebuilt Alternator to put in there ...On the 97 the alternator is a real nasty one to change and I can do it easy now ...The original alternator has a lot of brush wear and some of the insulating varnish is flaking off of the windings I took the cover off and looked ... It still works but I am sure it would go out soon ,,, :cool: CASSOPOLIS MICHIGAN BOB

THANKS AGAIN CDRU ...I have the box of gaskets un-opened sitting on the work bench I will return them ASAP to The "ZONE" and get the OEM ones from GM ... I am going to replace the alternator, Oxy sensor and temp sensor too while I am in there working on it ...On the 97 Trans Sport it is a big (size) alternator and you can't get it out without lowering the engine or removing all the stuff on top of the engine ...The old alternator I have has worn brushes and I see varnish insulation flaking off of the windings so it is about to go belly - up too ! ... I sure like this forum ! Thanks Again ! CDRU ......Cassopolis Michigan BOB

:) Update ... I have the engine heads off now only broke one exhaust stud and I was able to get it out ok ...Hardest part was getting the exhaust studs out on the bottom of the back manifold I had to use three 3/8 ratchet extensions to get to them from underneath ...I love that PB Blaster penetrant ! ...I am getting all new valves to install ...And I took back the gaskets to the "Zone" and bought a set from GM parts they assured me they were the latest version of the gaskets ... I found that the cylinders in the engine are like new ! No cylinder ridge at all AND the engine block has yellow paint pen numbers on it and a name I can not read I also found that many of the wiring harness clips behind the engine are not attached to the wiring ! So I think someone worked in there and forgot to attach them so I suspect this could be a low milage junk yard engine someone has installed in this van . I looked for the vin number on it and could not find one . Bob in Michigan :iceslolan

Hardest part was getting the exhaust studs out on the bottom of the back manifold I had to use three 3/8 ratchet extensions to get to them from underneath .You went the hard way. It's a lot easier to just leave the rear manifold on and remove it and the head together. It's a piece of cake to do it that way then try to reach em with the head on the engine. The crossover pipe also can be left on or taken off before the rear head comes off. When reassembling, you can get the rear all assembled on the bench then just toss it on the block. Spark plugs can also be done easily on the bench as well, just be sure to not bump the electrodes and change the gap.

:) Update on the trans Sport ... I did not like the looks of the valves they had tiny pits in them so I ordered all new ones and hand lapped them in ...Two had bad seats and I had those seats re-ground at an auto machine shop and I had the machinist inspect them ... The heads are back together now and I am ready to reassemble the engine ...EXCEPT now I am waiting for an EGR pipe gasket and the Spark Plugs ... Bob in Michigan

:smile: Update on the Trans Sport 3.4 L ... I took the exhaust pipe off and the crossover at the advice of CDRU and assembled the rear head , manifold and shields on the bench then I installed it as an assembly , that really was a lot easier !... That CDRU sure Knows his stuff ! Those shields are sharp I cut my thumb on one ...I got the latest improved GM gasket set ... They have you torque the CENTER bolts first on the lower intake manifold to 10 F.P. ...Per the instruction sheet with the new GM gaskets... I applied Blue (removable ) loktite to the bolts... during assembly ...
Now I am down to installing the bolt on accessories , Fuel injectors and upper intake manifold ... As with any big job I am worrying about the possibility that I forgot something or did not tighten something properly ... I am wondering what a job like this would cost if I had it done at a Auto dealership ? Take the engine heads off and do a complete valve job with all new valves ? Anyone know ? I am just curious BOB in Michigan

:biggrin: UPDATE ! I GOT THE TRANS SPORT ALL BACK TOGETHER ! ,
CHANGED THE OIL AND HAVE ONLY TO FILL THE COOLING SYSTEM BEFORE I CROSS MY FINGERS AND TURN THE KEY ...
The wife suggested I let it sit until tomorrow and we should go out to dinner ...hey I'm not going to argue ! I have to eat too ! BOB

:grinyes: :grinyes: Final Update on Transport ... After a few prayers (GOD IS GOOD ) I turned the key and started the transport ! IT RUNS ! IT IS VERY SMOOTH at idle now ... I ran it for about 1/2 hour the Coolant system came up to pressure nicely ...I still have a "check engine light " that is on all the time Perhaps I forgot to plug something in ? ...I don't have a code reader ..YET but I will soon to check that trouble code out ... Maybe someone out there can tell me about the "thing " they forget to connect or whatever is most likely to cause the "check engine " light to be on ? Anyway THANK YOU CDRU and everyone for your suggestions ,information and support ... BOB :)

If you had a check engine light on before, it will still be on. The codes don't erase. Get it checked out, erase it, then see if it comes back. The common sensors that I think get "lost" in the reassembly are the O2, MAP (? the one that's attached to the bracket that fits under the rear ignition module bracket studs), or a 2-wire sensor that runs down to the transmission somewhere.

Pull the code and see.

Follow UP on "Transport Head " I bought a Code reader on the internet it is coming ... I checked all the connectors and they all seem to be plugged in ...It will be interesting to see what the ODD2 code is when the reader comes... The Trans Sport engine really sounds good now ... BOB

I got a code reader a CREADER on Ebay Cost was 50 bucks with shipping ...Works good it cleared the codes and none have returned (SO FAR ) Now I am starting to fix the little things on this "Fixer-Upper" the heater /AC blower motor Does not work on all speeds and I found the resistor is fried .. So I need one of those yet and the Rear wiper does not work just goes click click ... I have decided this is not just a car to fix up
IT IS A CAREER ! BOB

:iceslolan :iceslolan WELL IT IS RUNNING GREAT ! We now have around 250 miles on it since the repairs and all is well ...We got 26.6 MPG with the first tank of gas ! ... THANKS EVERYONE FOR YOUR HELP ! ....BOB :smile:

FINAL FOLLOW UP on Head removal ...Well I now have 2000 miles on the Trans Sport since the "head / valve job " even drove it to downtown Chicago twice that was 100+ miles each way ... Trans Sport Runs great ,Idle is smooth and quiet ... THANKS TO CHRIS- CDRU and all you other guys too who replied to my "thread" for my successfully completed major repair ... BOB in MICHIGAN :iceslolan :smile: :iceslolan

Bob or Chris and all, I too have a 1997 Trans Port in need of new head gaskets and will begin this project this coming weekend. I will have the luxury of a full garage with lift and mechanic who will guide me on this, although I have to do all of the work. Sounds like you guys nailed it! Any last minute tips or pointers? My plan is to tear everything down this weekend, then go back in the following weekend and put it all back together with new gaskets. My mechanic recommends taking the heads to a machine shop for inspection? (Sounds expensive!) Also, just curious, Chris, you recommend OEM parts, yet these are the ones that have failed, and lastly, was there ever a factory recall for this problem?

Thanks to all

Bob or Chris and all, I too have a 1997 Trans Port in need of new head gaskets and will begin this project this coming weekend. I will have the luxury of a full garage with lift and mechanic who will guide me on this, although I have to do all of the work. Sounds like you guys nailed it! Any last minute tips or pointers? My plan is to tear everything down this weekend, then go back in the following weekend and put it all back together with new gaskets. My mechanic recommends taking the heads to a machine shop for inspection? (Sounds expensive!) Also, just curious, Chris, you recommend OEM parts, yet these are the ones that have failed, and lastly, was there ever a factory recall for this problem?

Thanks to all

ICEMAN
It has been sometime since I did the Transport head job ...Mine had one bad valve #3...I got a whole new set of exhaust valves on Ebay and took the heads to a auto machine shop to be checked he reground two valve seats and said everything was ok ...Would you belive he charged me 12 dollars ! ...I took the heads home assembled the valves and poured a little kerosene in back of each valve to be sure it did not leak ...Next I got gaskets at the GM dealer because Chris advised it ...GM made changes in the gaskets to fix some pesky leaking problems, the other gasket makers may not have made the changes ! so I highly recommend GM gaskets ...They did not cost much more than at the auto parts store ...I worked in an Automotive Factory as a mechanic I told the GM parts man I was a retired factory auto mechanic and he gave me a discount ! not a big one but hey it saved me a few bucks ...When I did the job I changed the alternator and belt too because the car had 103,000 miles on it that was easy with the heads off ...The Alternator is VERY HARD to change you have to lower the engine or take the heads off so I changed it , cost was 200 bucks at the Zone ...Chris recommended that I unbolt the exhaust joint on the right side of the engine and take the manifold off with the back head , this makes the job easier he said (and it Was ! ) you put it back together that way too... I broke one manifold bolt off on the head then I used PB Blaster on the rest of the manifold bolts and did not break another one ...Squirt the blaster on a bolt work the bolt back and forth a tiny bit to get the blaster penetrating oil in there and work the manifold bolts out back and forth a little like you were tapping a hole and they will come out ok ...The blaster keeps the bolt from seizing in the aluminum ...The bolt I broke off I drilled out and re tapped the hole ...Your new GM intake manifold gasket is a special low torque gasket ! it will come with special instructions as to torque and which bolts to tighten in which sequence ! follow them to the letter... One thing I would recommend is to take out the lifters while you have it apart , take the lifters apart, examine them make sure they are ok and clean them up ... Be sure you put them back in the same spot they came out of ...I did not clean the lifters and my engine went TICK,TICK ,TICK until it had warmed up... I think it was the dirty lifters I should have cleaned them ...Another thing I did was when I got it back together I flushed the engine twice with water then installed the regular green antifreeze and distilled water I do not like the orange stuff ...I traded the Transport off recently with 13,000 miles on it since I did the head job ... I was quite proud of my work other than the ticking at start up it ran like a new car ! Thats all I can think of hope it helps you , good luck with your Transport head job this weekend ! ...Bob in Michigan

ICEMAN
It has been sometime since I did the Transport head job ...Mine had one bad valve #3...I got a whole new set of exhaust valves on Ebay and took the heads to a auto machine shop to be checked he reground two valve seats and said everything was ok ...Would you belive he charged me 12 dollars ! ...I took the heads home assembled the valves and poured a little kerosene in back of each valve to be sure it did not leak ...Next I got gaskets at the GM dealer because Chris advised it ...GM made changes in the gaskets to fix some pesky leaking problems, the other gasket makers may not have made the changes ! so I highly recommend GM gaskets ...They did not cost much more than at the auto parts store ...I worked in an Automotive Factory as a mechanic I told the GM parts man I was a retired factory auto mechanic and he gave me a discount ! not a big one but hey it saved me a few bucks ...When I did the job I changed the alternator and belt too because the car had 103,000 miles on it that was easy with the heads off ...The Alternator is VERY HARD to change you have to lower the engine or take the heads off so I changed it , cost was 200 bucks at the Zone ...Chris recommended that I unbolt the exhaust joint on the right side of the engine and take the manifold off with the back head , this makes the job easier he said (and it Was ! ) you put it back together that way too... I broke one manifold bolt off on the head then I used PB Blaster on the rest of the manifold bolts and did not break another one ...Squirt the blaster on a bolt work the bolt back and forth a tiny bit to get the blaster penetrating oil in there and work the manifold bolts out back and forth a little like you were tapping a hole and they will come out ok ...The blaster keeps the bolt from seizing in the aluminum ...The bolt I broke off I drilled out and re tapped the hole ...Your new GM intake manifold gasket is a special low torque gasket ! it will come with special instructions as to torque and which bolts to tighten in which sequence ! follow them to the letter... One thing I would recommend is to take out the lifters while you have it apart , take the lifters apart, examine them make sure they are ok and clean them up ... Be sure you put them back in the same spot they came out of ...I did not clean the lifters and my engine went TICK,TICK ,TICK until it had warmed up... I think it was the dirty lifters I should have cleaned them ...Another thing I did was when I got it back together I flushed the engine twice with water then installed the regular green antifreeze and distilled water I do not like the orange stuff ...I traded the Transport off recently with 13,000 miles on it since I did the head job ... I was quite proud of my work other than the ticking at start up it ran like a new car ! Thats all I can think of hope it helps you , good luck with your Transport head job this weekend ! ...Bob in Michigan


I just thought of a couple more things ...When I did the Transport valve job I took lots and lots of pictures with my digital camera then when I put it back together I went back to the pictures to see how things went together...This helped a lot ...Another thing I did is I got a box of small zip lock bags at the grocery and when I took something off the car I put all the bolts and small parts into a zip lock bag then I label it on the outside with a permanent marker so I know where they go ... This helped a lot too ...

The wiring on the Transport is not much of a problem on some cars you have to mark all the plugs and things but on the Transport I had to mark only a few electrical items because the plugs are all different sizes so you can't get them plugged in wrong they won't fit ...

BOB

Thanks, Bob, I'm going in tomorrow. A friend of mine is from England and he's moving back there this summer, he gave me the van, I plan on using it for the beach here in coastal Virginia, I've do some projects with engines, but nothing like this. I'll have the luxury of an experienced mechanic showing me the way, he said it would take him four hours to break it down. Good advice about the zip lock bags and alternator, my goal is to keep overall cost below $600, including the inspection by the machine shop.

Mark

Sludge! Sludge! Everywhere, took eight hours to get the manifold oof, have not removed the heads yet, beginning to wonder if this is worth the trouble.

I just thought of a couple more things ...When I did the Transport valve job I took lots and lots of pictures with my digital camera then when I put it back together I went back to the pictures to see how things went together...This helped a lot ...Another thing I did is I got a box of small zip lock bags at the grocery and when I took something off the car I put all the bolts and small parts into a zip lock bag then I label it on the outside with a permanent marker so I know where they go ... This helped a lot too ...


Bob, do you still have those digital photos?

Thanks to all the posters, especially Bob and Chris. After approximately 12 or so man hours spread out over 4 Saturdays, I finally got the heads off - what a pain! The steps posted in http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=321467&page=8 for the removal of the intake manifolds on a Chevy Venture were right on the money. I quickly took the heads to the machine shop, but they're back-logged, arrrgh! I want to get them back on before I forget everything. The hardest part for me was the ignition coil pack, I removed each of the six screws and the three coils, rotated the engine forward with a rope, tied it off to the bumper, and was able to get the coil bracket off, I then removed the alternator, and bracket - got real lucky I did it in that order, because the bracket was needed to pull the engine forward, I was then able to remove the rear valve cover, and everything went fast from there, removed the rear head with the exhaust manifold and cross-over pipe still attached, however the oxygen sensor and the stainless steel shiny flexible hose (egr, maybe?) were still attached so I just separated the exhaust manifold from the rear head while still in the engine well. Turns out the cylinder closest to the front passenger seat (standing in front of the vehicle, looking into the engine well, the cylinder farthest back to the left) was full of antifreeze, my buddy told me that was where it was leaking, he also doesn’t believe the heads sustained any damage. Is there anything I can do in the mean time while waiting for the heads to come back that may help speed up the installation?

Mark

If anyone's still out there, do you know if you can re-install everything, including valve cover and coil assembly, to rear head before installing head back on the block? I thought I read somewhere along the way it was possible to do this. Is this even an issue?