Project GSX:


we located a 2g awd dsm and are building it and the owner wants raw power ... i explained lag to him and he asked the question: well whats the baddest turbo i can get that has the most liveable lag for daily driving....

soo.... i checked most of the major sites and couldnt find anything specific cause honestly im not that familiar with the trims and inducer sizes etc... i know the basics and which turbo has what for power and what kind of lag ... but besides the evo III big 16g I havent found a turbo that puts out REAL good power and doesnt have a ridiculous lag.

so any help? advice?

That's really a question of choice. It used to be that a 16g was a street turbo, and a 20g was almost a race-only turbo. Now, 20g/50 trim level is called the best street turbo. Make the decision based on horsepower, 1/4 mile time, or full boost by RPM. I suggest the first 2 options.

Road racers sometimes use ball-bearing turbos, if they aren't going to use a 16g sized "low lag" one. A lot of companies make garrett BB combinations, where some examples are the SBR GT series (GT10 through GT14) and the FP3052 and FP3065 from Forced Performance.
FYI, and this all varies by setup, a good setup that your friend might have will spool faster than these.
FP3052 52lbs/min 3400rpm 22psi
SBR GT12 55lbs/min, said to have about the same spool
Both ball bearing capable of 500+whp.
FP Green, THE 50 trim to get, 49lbs/min, 3800rpm 20psi 450whp+
20g, 44lbs/min, 400+whp 3500rpm about

There are also a few other series' of turbos like the AGP garretts, and the Extreme Turbo line.

It seems like power and spool are related to eachother very linearly, and a ball bearing setup drops the RPM, but is on a parallel a few hundred RPM lower.

Joe ...... that was kickass. exactly what I was looking for!

THX

The turbos are all listed here (http://devnulled.com/archives/2004/01/flow_and_hp_ratings_for_popular_dsm_turbos.php) by flow, but to find spool times and dynos, your best bet is DSMtuners (www.dsmtuners.com). Keep in mind that there is a big difference in spool time AND power for every mod that someone has or doesn't have. Big differences between a ported 1g head/2g, 2g intake manifold/sheetmetal aftermarket, cams, etc... BB turbos are almost all around $1200-1300, where one of the best 20g's (tdo6h) is usually under $1000. Kevin's 430whp pump gas turbo, a 20g hybrid, is for sale with 0 miles for $900. Not sure if you knew that, but you can ask him what kind of lag he had on that.

whats his name on here so i can pm him?

Kevin...AKA GOD... is 95GSXracer. :thumbsup:

You're making me blush!

The turbo I have for sale is larger than a 20g. It did do 430 pump gas WHP though... Lots more in it, that compresor wheel has done 600 whp on race gas and high boost. I got full boost by 4400 rpm, which I dont consider laggy enough to not run it on the street. PErfectly livalbe for me. I think my new turbo spools at closer to 5000rpm, lol. And when I say 4400 rpm, thats not what it spools up to 15 psi at, thats 25 psi. Not too bad.

If thats too laggy, I think the TDO6H 20g is my favorite streetable turbo. Full boost by about 3800 rpm if I remember correctly, again 25 psi, and it was eficient enough to run that on pump gas. I did 400 whp on that turbo on pump. Still more in it of course. PEople have run low 11s and high 10s on 20Gs.

The AGP kit with a Stage3/.82 housing and TO4E/50 trim will spool in the same range and offer some good HP. Similar to a 20g. Or a stage3/.63 with a 60-1/TSO4 if you want to go bigger and stay garret. The advantage here is you can swap parts all day long until you find the combination of spool and power you want. And parts and rebuidls are cheap. See www.agpturbo.com for details.

The bolt on GT turbos from SBR are good too, I would sugest the GT12. Ball bearing so you dont have to worry about thrust bearing failure, but make sure you put a PROPER filter on the oil feed line.

The ball bearing turbos dont seem to spool any faster than regulkar turbos. For example, a friend with a setup very similar to mine with a GT14 got full boost at the same rpm the M14 I'm selling got full boost at for me. Same compressor wheels. ;)

ITs a lot to think about. The turbo is the single most important part in the setup as far as how much the maximum power potential of the carwill be. ALL of the other supporting mods and tuning will determine how close to that potential you will come. ;) Good luck...

If thats too laggy, I think the TDO6H 20g is my favorite streetable turbo. Full boost by about 3800 rpm if I remember correctly, again 25 psi, and it was eficient enough to run that on pump gas. I did 400 whp on that turbo on pump. Still more in it of course. PEople have run low 11s and high 10s on 20Gs.


yep you are about right on... i love my turbos... i got them off of a TT dragster and they are TD06H 20g's and i put one on the RST and the other on the GST and i can hit full boost right around 3800-4000rpms... in the RST if i spray i can hit full boost around 2900-3000rpms! they are such fun turbo's... although i need something bigger but i have to wait until i get the spyder first!