Continuation from 86v8 Camaro vs. 3000gt SL

Ok, so you have $2000 cost, sounds good... I guess Ridge went to bed already??

http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/watermark.php?file=/500/103270buggy.jpg

feast you eyes on this!!

This is the official project dune buggy!!!!!

oh, it looks safer than i first imagined

I can contribute and I already have all the tools we will need except for the torch

hell yea, the buggy has pretty much a stock vw motor with a dual weber carb set up, i looked it over at the track last week, friday when i go if hes there ill get all the specs and the total cost it costed him to bulid it

Also ridge the last ten pages in that other thread where all us we started on page 3

One thing we must have though is fuel inection but we will get the system with the engine

what kind of torch... my friend has an arc welder

If we are gonna build this, i probably only come up w/ a couple hundred, but I'm figuring we can ALL make our investment back if ya know what I mean

Perfect thats all we need, I have depth setting tools, impact wrenchs , dial indicators , we are ready to go once we have prints or a frame

We also need a location to build it

lol, hmmm, you are inbetween me and ridge, so that might be the best

BTW check this out, http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=632&item=2393854345&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

Oh, on a side note, do you guys know why "c a m a r o" got banned

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2473537706&category=33615

also this http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2473486983&category=46093&sspagename=WDVW

hmmmmm

No but I also don't know who Camaro is but I almost got banned today

do yall have your minds set on the porshe engine?
got some cash lol http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2473784483&category=33615

you could also find an engine like this fairly cheap
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2472640942&category=33615

Ok our price of building just dropped to $1500.00

you think we could get a few more investors?

banned for?, oh, those videos right

OK you know what lets start thinking outside the box. why do we have to build a German enginered buggy lets make the engine a 350 Small block with a custom driveshaft for rear engine mount and front wheel drive or even better 4x4 with all GM parts

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=10781&item=3672180455&rd=1
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=7900265576&category=34202
these are cheap vw engines with potential

Yeah gotta love the import threads

why not just mount it longitudnally in the rear

oh, my bad, you said FWD

haha, that would be interesting, i have a th350 tranny sitting around, and i have a crack 350 sitting around also, and i have a 3000 stall for that th 350...

how much HP do we want/need?

Come on with the right parts and no emissions we can build a buggy with balls, Also are all buggy's manual or Auto

a vw engines are moslty sticks, 4 sp, but they do have these auto stick pieces of junk

what we want is 300 + Goal horse which is easy cause you figure we are working with shorter exhaust and induction ports and no emissions

But we need a strong engine to start with... I don't know VW's so i don't know anything about those, I was just saying, will they cut it

Will we rip out systems such as PCV?

Stick is cool, one bonus of going with 350 is low end torque this combined with the drivetrain of one of the 4 wheel drive trucks like the blazer customized to work with the buggy length would jump off the line

well, you gotta decide which engine you wanna go with, the porshe engine would be badass but really expensive, now the vw motors are cheap and the mods are cheap, me and my dad just built an 1835cc motor for our bug, with a hot cam, its pretty damn quick

Also a bonus of going with a 4 wheel drive set up is that we don't has to worry as much about the take off

but those 4x4 axles and tranfer case is gonna add alot more weight, i say stick to rear wheel drive

you think you can custom fit the 4x4 system

Still porshe engine would be cool , I don't know its up to you guys , the only thing for sure is no VW engine cause almost all of them use them

We could always weigh down the front just a little for counter balance... wheelie bars sound good too

350 sounds good to me

Oh yeah its not that hard its just 2 differentials instead of one and a transfer case, you can pick these parts up from a junk yard but ridge is right rear wheel drive is better for performance wise and wheelie bars will look awesome

plus it will be simpler to build... so we'll mount the engine cross-wise in the back? We'll need a FWD tranny then right

No I can't think of any tranny that is front wheel drive and used with the 350

I think we would need to custom build something .

but you can't mount the enigne in the back and use a RWD tranny, because it is made to transfer the power to the OPPOSITE wheels, you'd need a FWD set-up only on the back wheels

wait, how do they put 350's in Pontiac Fierro's???

you could stick the thing up front, have it set up just like any other car, but then you would have a serious problem with traction

OK I got you we buy the plans and we build the frame and we extend the frame in the rear by 2 1/2 to 3 Feet and use a gearbox without a driveshaft to operate the rear wheels

or you could mount a mid engine design, have a regualar tranny and rwd, just a real short driveshaft

Is there gonna be a Diff? or just link the trans directly to the wheels, solid axle and such

Also this will improve handling by creating a closer mid engine mount design

how is the VW buggy set up??

so will the driver sit in front of the engine?

it will mount just like a regular drivetrain but without the use of the driveshaft, it will go engine tranny differential

well the vw is alot easier, its a rear engine with a trans axle, rwd and i think it might even be posi, they jus take the rear out of a vw and bolt it directly the the buggy frame

but wouldn't a solid axle be better for a drag car, which is what we are essentially making, do we need to turn?

take pictures when you do it!

Yeah the engine will be behind you and you will need to build a radiator into the front frame of the buggy because the 350 isn't air cooled like the porshe and VW

i like the 350 idea that thing would f*cking scat!!:evillol:

well for the front end, all you would need it a doner vw, jus take the front end off of the vw and weld it directly to the frame of the buggy

Oh this thing is going to be awesome

yea you could sit the rad . on top of the steering colum, kinda at an angle, and jus weld up some brackets, i think thatd be the best place

coolant hoses running along both sides back to the engine?

I have so many people I want to Whoop with this thing!

and if you do mid engine, we need to think of a way to control the engine/ trans, we could mount the carb on backwards, the hook the linkage up to the pedals, now the trans will be interesting...

now that we are going with the 350 though what induction system do we use, there is the good old 4 barrel great power but not reliable as say FI and then there is TPI awesome torque but flat top end or TBI which I don't want

what's wrong with a Carb?

yea we could drop a stock 350 on this thing and still be really fast, for the axle, i say a 10 bolt posi, maybe 4.10 gears? we might not need to go that high tho, maybe 3.42s

4 brl might be the easiest unless you could come up with a cheap tpi and wiring harness, and where are we gonna put all this shit on this little buggy!!! lol

we won't need all that torque, it weighs nothing, shorter gears mean more top end, but what ever you guys like

Carb is OK with me

I thought it was gonna be as non-computerized as possible

carb overall would be easier, but fi is ok too

It'll be outside and breathe fine, just a big-ass Carb and open headers

put some dragster style headers on there.. haha

You know what though think about this, I think TPI is going to be the way to go, I can get a system from a junk yard for dirt cheap and while the engine is waiting to be installed we put in a better cam and work the heads or even swap them for the aluminum corvette Hi Flow heads and this set -up is 350 Horsepower area

lol, but will we even need all that power, we probably won't go faster than 80 or so in this thing, i mean, if you have the money who am I to argue

Plus you have the added bonus of fuel injection reliablity

if we do TPI let's run an intake pipe t othe front and mount a Big filter, there ya go... Ram-air

haha, this is gonna have to be a strong chassis, the regualar frame is gonna have to be strenghtened, and theres gonna need to be mounts welded in for the rear, the trans, and engine

hopefully it wont fly... haha

I didn't even think of that, we are gonna twist the SH*T outta this thing... maybe Torque isn't the way to go

You what I'm sorry guys I was just thinking let just do carb the wiring and computer program would be a nightmare , sorry went off track there

it sounded good

well if we have a stall is wont be a sudden twist, it will be kinda like a small twist then like a big pull kinda thing or something

lol. carb sounds cool and alot less mess

ok, but still, the rotating force of the driveshaft (clockwise or counterclockwise) will affect the frame... one side will be pushed down the other up

The aluminum TPI system with a long cone filet attached to the front of the MAF would look awesome and be more reliable but the added work and amount of performance you are getting we would be better off going carb

lots of steel and many welds will take care of that

ok, so the 350 is going to be used for the engine, how bout trans??

as long as you know it will... even Camaro frames are known to twist after years of abuse especially verts or Ttop cars

OK I'm going to bed in like 10 minutes , but before I do let decide what kind of donor car we want the 350 from so I can check prices today ,which tranny and how many speed's we want ( I think we decided Manual) and which rear- end we are going with

Stick or auto, auto might be easier

or not

We can use a x brace under the frame or even rig some sub frames connectors up I think frame bending is last thing to worry about

oo and one of the mods might move this thread to a diff category, hopefully they wont :)

so what trans?

that'd be messed up, it's a Camaro, it's based around a 350

if this is gonna be a mid engine car its gonna be kinda hard to shift eh?? i guess for a doner car something cheap and very common, maybe a old caprice or.... pickuptruck

makes sense to me

jus check the prices on all cars that have the 350

is the stick gonna be hard to rig up, clutch 'n all

OK I say we just go basic 5 speed tranny from 87-91 Camaro

so that's the car we want for donor, a shame to rip up a camaro

well if its a mid engine manual, there gonna have a be a shifter that comes up the the driver seat, thats gonna be tricky dont you think???

that's y i'm voting for an auto

yea look for a wrecked camaro, im sure you couldpick one of those up cheap, or one will lost title

OK either auto or manual works for me but we could use a linkage cable for the tranny like used in the old manual sterring colum shifter's

uh, not to familar with that, but if you say so

sounds nifty, you ever heard that saying "3 on the three"

OK ridge what do you think Auto or stick>

???

whats that a 3 speed manual?

hmm, damn y does it have to be put on me.. lol, whichever yall want, stick would be funner but also maybe a little harder to actually do

OK if I'm not mistaken anyway doesn't a manual use a shifter that transfer movement to a linkage usually located on the side on the tranny to decide gear placement

lol, i guess it's up to you

yea i think so theres these sayings i heard, like "4 on the floor" and "3 on the tree" i think the 3 on the tree is the manual colum shifter thing

i thought it was ontop, i thought there was linkage that came out the top of the trans that went straight in the car

colum shifter came in 4 speed but I'm not sure about 3 most where used in early chevy station wagons and 4 door sedans

i kno the auto has the linkage on the side

lol, let's make a decision

I remember I once made a mod to my 87 Corvette which had a 4+3 tranny which was basically just your average 4 speed with a overdrive coupler and the gear indicator linkage was located on the driver side of the tranny and the shifter was just bolted to its location and used a linkage to transfer movement but I'm not sure if this is the norm

auto would be the easiest

you can jus check the prices on both and see which would be cheaper

OK auto is fine but which auto th350, 700r4 or something else?

OK I will check as much as I can and get back to you guys later on today

cheapest, but that wouldn't break mated to the engine

hey can you change the ame of the thread to camaro/dune buggy .. haha so they dont move it

aight, I think it's time for bed for me, i'l be back here tomorrow

oo dman its almost 430.. haha o well i dont work tom hah

OK I need sleep, have a good day guys talk to you later

night

yea im goin to bed too..... later

damm i wish you guys were closer to CA cause i have alota stuff that would help got a welder , torch , plus a 91 RS for parts!!!! oh well

damm i wish you guys were closer to CA cause i have alota stuff that would help got a welder , torch , plus a 91 RS for parts!!!! oh well
Yeah that would be cool, the 91 would help big time too but what ya going to do,
But I did find this which should be the engine I'm still working on finding the tranny but check this out
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=7900018499&category=34206

Oh this would work out , too http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2473576307&category=33615

OK I think 700R4 is way to go, www.car-part.com has one's for like 150 -200

you did notice they were pick up only right but is car part localy or do they ship?

Yeah , not a problem my I have can borrow my family's ford ranger to pick up the engine tranny whatever

OK I think we should go with a Ford 9 Inch rear end from a ford truck do to better gear ratio's used . I checked and we could pick one up for around 150 - 200 in PA & NY whole carrier assembly

thats cool, would it need to be shortend ?

If we build the frame and use correct front axle lengths we could leave it the way it is plus we would have brakes then too

yea, well whats gonna be used for the front end?

A FORD rear, lol, i don't know...

i drive a ford, it has a 9 in rear, i havent had many problems with the truck

The ford 9 inch rear is one solid rear , it can handle alot of torque and when buying a used rear 10 bolts 7.5 rears like the ones used on 3rd and 4th gens are very weak but Grand Nationals & F- boys use the Ford rear so what the hell

it would have to be custom mad or we can just go all around front axle's from 2x4 Bronco

that could work, we could use pretty much any front end, but which would be the lightest, i still say we use a vw front end, its alot simpler and less complex

ok, wait, i'm a little late, we are gonna use a Ford rear end and a VW front?

Yeah VW front would work

WHEN THE HELL DID SOMEONE START A DUNE BUGGY THREAD!?!?!?
my friend and i building a 4WD buggy with a ground up custom chassis powered by a custom turbo charged R6 motorcycle racing engine.

Cool bring it over to NY and we'll race

i'll see you next summer...

damn, this is serious

damn, what happened to our buggy

I was just waiting for someone to show some interest again, I'm ready to get to work

yea it jus kinda died there, we need to find some more people interested in this that are on the mid east coast so we can have some more money to put into this thing

it could be completely assembled for under $2000.00 most likely we can do it for 1500.00 It we just get 5 people thats just a 300.00 dollar investment and we wouldn't even need all the money up front as this would be a weekend proect that would take a minimum of 5-6 weeks

yea, it could be a weekend thing, i cant do anything until i get another f*ckin job, ive enjoyed these few weeks off, but im broke :( i have a perfect 350 i jus got back from the machine shop waiting for assembly, i got the pistons and rods, but i left the fuckin crank outside and it rusted, so when i start bringin im some cash im down

Yeah, I hear yeah, I'm thinking of just starting the frame assembly now with my portion and waiting for new interest. Because I know if I don't start building it up soon it going to become one those remember when you wanted to build a (fill in here) projects

haha yea, my vw is still sittin out front with a brand new motor in it, the ignition is a little messed up, but im too lazy to go and fix it and ive been workin on the camaro, gettin it ready, i cant wait to get her goin again, and we have a van that needs a new clutch, and my truck needs a new exhaust, damn fix a ticket

Yeah , I wish I could not finish something after I start it but I think I have obsesive compulsive disorder as once I start working on something I can't sleep until its finished the way I want it

I've pretended to be sick to stay home and work on my transmission line pressure

lol, i always get side tracked, now if i had all the money i needed i would prolly have all cars fixed and have the camaro running by now if only i could sell my damn dirtbike

Yeah I hear ya, Mods don't come cheap. I have had to sacrifice many a time to buy a modification

Well forget mods car parts in general

yea some parts are crazy expensive, they rip you off soo bad on them but you gotta have them, its costing me 140 bucks to get my heads miled and cleaned, and its costs 100 to get a crank grounded, shit i can buy a new crank for 100, the heads tho, there dart heads, they dont come cheap

o well tho, i have 2 brand new complete motors by the summer, my 350 and 383

Yo, 2 things...
You know I'm done, little broke right now, but when summer hits hopefully I'll be getting money, so I could hit you off, and I told you I'd come help work on it.
2) Are you still gonna come to LI saturday?

Yeah Friday or Saturday and maybe both. Which day do you wanna race?. Sunday would even work for me

Well, R we gonna race at night, like meet up at dpa or sumthin, or just anytime during the day... I'm planning on hanging out around DPA or Edison this weekend, nothing else going on.

Well I have something to do in the early evening on Saturday but besides that pretty much the rest of the weekend is free.

I think me and a few homies plan on going to edison sat night...I went there late, @3AM this passed Saturday, no one was there, 'cept one 5.0. Anyway, after chattin for ten minuets we were about to be out, then, boom, mad Mustangs and cars showed up. Nobody wanted to run, so I ended up gettin conned into it...
Le mans smoke me twice, first launch I amost hooked into a pole, second I let off at idle.
Then I raced this 94 or 95 Mustang, it was from Canada, had kilo's instead of miles, and 5.0 instead of 4.6.
Whoop him first time, he started making BS excuses, second try, STALLED, oops. Third time he had the jump on me.

Well Sounds cool, I'm down. the later the better for me

also just wanted you to see you're still gonna whoop me

well I noticed you didn't sell the car that sucks!, But We'll race and I don't think I will kill you . I think it will be closer than you think but I'm planning on winning

ok, but then after this race, you come back after a few more months when I really know how to drive

Why, you must have some skills by now

But I have no problem racing you more than once as I'm not planning on going any where

lol, yea, I can churp into second, and sometimes into third, but i'm not as consistent as I would like to be... I might have a good race, might have a bad, we'll have to run a couple of times.
I do not know how to launch for shit... you have a stall right?

Yeah but cause I use my car for street duty its very mild but it I launch too high I do nothing spin anyway so it works fine for what I use it for

What's the speed???

1800 Stall speed but I think my Tranny line pressure is too high can some times it will jerk at idle

I don't think I asked you, How old are you Joe?

21, and lovin it... So you wont take off til your RPMs reach 1800 then, right?

Thats what it should be under heavy throttle position but it doesn't always work that way

Ok, i got ya... BTW, couldn't you just power break to get the same effect?

No stock converter will usually lock up and spin the rear at around 1200 -1300 while aftermarket will allow for higher rev but the stall speed depends on alot of variables and isn't always right on more of a estimate of when contact should be made

ok, casue in my auto i used to hold the break and rev to about 2000 before a race, and it worked fin, no spin... but that was a v6... so i'm gonna have to dupm my clutch at 1800 to be even

Best launch is somewhere around 2000 -2500 for you as long as wheel spin isn't a major issue