hey fellas,

its been awhile since I posted, but I just got a 2001 electron pearl blue prelude 5 speed and am ready for some power. Should I supercharge it or turbo? which will give better gains in HP? advantages and disadvantages of both? I will be replacing internals of the engine of course. And NOS will be on the shopping list also. please give any advice that will help my mecca to v-8 killing.

turbo will produce more power, especially if you upgrade the internals in the future and decide to run more boost. superchargers available for the prelude max out at 9psi. the turbo system could theoretically push as much boost as your motor can handle once built for strength.

be different, buy the tornado

you should go with the turbo

GO WITH THE SUPERCHARGER!

Supercharges run on high rpm so if the prelude doesnt have high rpm then you're screwed with the supercharger or else go with the supercharger. If rpm is not high enough then make it higher!

SUPERCHARGER!

Originally posted by Type R
GO WITH THE SUPERCHARGER!

Supercharges run on high rpm so if the prelude doesnt have high rpm then you're screwed with the supercharger or else go with the supercharger. If rpm is not high enough then make it higher!

SUPERCHARGER!


SPEAK ENGLISH!!! :mad:

I'll say it again, can't go wrong with a tornado in your intake tract

:mad: I SPEAKISH ENGALISHH!

I don't like the time lapse before turbo start so that is why I would go with supercharger because the power is there when you need it.:bloated:

Originally posted by Type R
I don't like the time lapse before turbo start so that is why I would go with supercharger because the power is there when you need it.:bloated:


you have much to learn about properly sizing a turbo for it's application.

for example: a T3/T4 hybrid turbo packaged with todays kits is entirely too large for only boosting 6-10psi. use a T3, or in the case of the D16, use a T28... it spools up faster, produces enough boost to do the job, and with a good wastegate, boost controller, and properly sized impellers, will build boost almost as quickly as a supercharger... and with the thermal efficiency added in, build more power.

i can properly match a motor with a good turbo setup that will either build boost down low for off the line performance (under 2000rpm), or build one that needs nitrous just to get the fan spinning but reach 35psi at redline.

it's all about tuning... and superchargers arent tuneable. they have poor thermal efficiency, roots type blowers arent able to be intercooled (water injection only), they require motor power to be driven, they require belt changes every 10k miles, limited to 9psi in Honda applications, 6psi on stock pulley. they may build boost off the line, but a turbo can do it just as well.

FINANCIALLY IN THE LAND OF OZ SUPERCHARGING IS WAY LESS EXSPENSIVE THEN TURBOING IF YOU ARE GOING TO KEEP STOCK INTERNALS. SAFE PRESSURE SHOULD NOT EXCEED 7PSI IF YOU LOVE YOUR PISTONS AND MOST TURBO OWNERS YOU WILL FIND, ALWAYS START PUMPING IN ALITTLE BIT MORE UNTIL BANG! ITS ALL OVER. THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN WITH THE SUPERCHARGER IS TO BE CHANGING PULLEYS BUT THIS WONT HAPPEN.
SO FOR PRICE AND POWER GO SUPERCHARGER AND TO THE TOSS WHO KEEPS REPEATING SUPERCHARGERS REV HIGHER TO MAKE MORE BOOST, SHUTUP OR TALK TO A FENCE.

Originally posted by pvang31019
I'll say it again, can't go wrong with a tornado in your intake tract Sorry, but I´ve heard that this "tornado" is crap!:p

If you don't like turbo lag, get some NOS!!!!

And I to have seen tests performed showing that the tornado is garbage. Even at the shows when you try and talk to them, they sound ignorant. Their display consists of a kindergarten science experiment. All they have is two 2litre bottles with that little plastic piece joining them together making a cool little whirlpool. Wow, that's gonna make me buy one! NOT!!!

ummm...I was being sarcastic.....:frog:

If you're gonna be a flat-out dragster, go with the turbo. With properly built internals and stripping of the car (5G Lude = tank, no offense mang...), you will be whooping V8s all day long. Happy Boosting :)

Originally posted by MARKUSIUDIUS
FINANCIALLY IN THE LAND OF OZ SUPERCHARGING IS WAY LESS EXSPENSIVE THEN TURBOING IF YOU ARE GOING TO KEEP STOCK INTERNALS. SAFE PRESSURE SHOULD NOT EXCEED 7PSI IF YOU LOVE YOUR PISTONS AND MOST TURBO OWNERS YOU WILL FIND, ALWAYS START PUMPING IN ALITTLE BIT MORE UNTIL BANG! ITS ALL OVER. THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN WITH THE SUPERCHARGER IS TO BE CHANGING PULLEYS BUT THIS WONT HAPPEN.
SO FOR PRICE AND POWER GO SUPERCHARGER AND TO THE TOSS WHO KEEPS REPEATING SUPERCHARGERS REV HIGHER TO MAKE MORE BOOST, SHUTUP OR TALK TO A FENCE.

First of, you're definitely wrong. You'd have to change the internals on the supercharger just to compare boost with a turbo kit using a $50 manual boost controller. And, you didn't specify which powerplant can only handle 7psi. Yes, that's true in a weak engine, but the newer Civic's can handle 9psi with an intercooler and not internal mods. FMAX puts this kit out. I run a Greddy 15G which is smaller (and spools faster) at 8psi WITHOUT an intercooler.
Also, supercharging is not as efficient as turbocharging. Fact is superchargers are belt-driven. Any extra load on the engine will consume more gas. Where the turbo is driven off of already existing exhaust pressure, you actually get better gas mileage because the engine doesn't have to strain anymore.
Also, were you going to tell everyone that when the supercharger gets hot it's harder to turn over or even start the damn thing without a big ass battery?? Check out some of the pics of the battery on the F-150 Lightning.
Anywho, I believe these posts are for posting the pro's and con's of each system, not trying to sell a kit off to someone, but letting them make their choice based on YOUR experiences. Just be truthful.

I personally would go with the supercharger because there is no time lapse before you get turbo and you supercharger is more reliable. The power is there when you need it even though it's weaker. But it's also less expensive? Yup. That's just my opinion.:bloated:

My pick would be a turbo. Here's why;

Turbo:

Since the turbo is driven off the exhaust it takes no power away from the engine. Also the turbo is only working when you mash the gas so you can maintain good gas mileage while just cruisin’. The only downside is the turbo lag. But that has greatly been reduced over the years.

Super:

Belt driven so the power is instant. But there are two downsides. Since it is always running, it is always using gas. Bye bye good gas mileage. It also required power to run the Super so you don't get as much power.

To me the turbo has been and always will be the better choice. Besides you aren't realty seeing you engines real power until about 3500+ RPM at least. By then the turbo has already spooled up.

Hmm... ok I'm starting to like turbo now.
:bloated:

Originally posted by Type R
Hmm... ok I'm starting to like turbo now.
:bloated: I´m not thinking about both of them anymore now.... :D
Turbo: Too expensive for me! (to rebuild the internals and stuff)
SC: Low mileage! => expensive again (gas is damn expensive over here):(

You can get a turbo setup w/out upgrading the internals. It's just that if you want to turn the boost up, then you need to start making the engine better. But you should be able to run something on a stock engine w/out blowing it up. I'm having a custom turbo kit installed and the guy said it'll run at 8psi but if I want it higher, then I have to do a lot of things. But the plus side of doing all those extra things is that then my engine will be able to handle some nos as well :) bye bye turbo lag!! Hell, I might even throw in a bigger turbo at that point :)

Originally posted by Polygon
My pick would be a turbo. Here's why;

Turbo:

Since the turbo is driven off the exhaust it takes no power away from the engine. Also the turbo is only working when you mash the gas so you can maintain good gas mileage while just cruisin’. The only downside is the turbo lag. But that has greatly been reduced over the years.

Super:

Belt driven so the power is instant. But there are two downsides. Since it is always running, it is always using gas. Bye bye good gas mileage. It also required power to run the Super so you don't get as much power.

To me the turbo has been and always will be the better choice. Besides you aren't realty seeing you engines real power until about 3500+ RPM at least. By then the turbo has already spooled up.

Not entirely true. First of all, a turbo, when out of boost, puts a hp drag on the car. Secondly, lag, and boost threshold, for that matter, is completely determined by matching the size of the turbo to the motor in question. Finally, the power of a turbo is not limitless. It is restricted by the surge limit.

As for superchargers, all the Eaton blowers I know of use an internal bypass valve that is actuated by vaccum pressure. Boost is somewhat dictated by throttle pressure. That means that when you're just cruising at part throttle, you can say "hello gas mileage". (Or you can add a one way checkvalve and switch to your bypass valve like I did and completely cut off boost.) Power from a supercharger is off idle. I can floor it well below 3500 and break the tires loose.

I'll be the first to admit that a turbo is much more versatile and, with the wide variety and selection available, can be more suitably matched to compliment an engine's particular characteristics. But superchargers are not as bad as they're made out to be either. Choosing one is a matter of finding which suits your needs and driving style better. Both of them are an excellent way to add power to a small motor.

Check out Alan Paradise's article written with the assistance of both Corky Bell and Oscar Jackson.

http://www.geocities.com/eyores1/page1.html

oooo...
Is adding Turbo on a Integra Type R's 197 horse power engine a good idea?
Anybody know how much that would cost?:bloated:

Originally posted by Type R
oooo...
Is adding Turbo on a Integra Type R's 197 horse power engine a good idea?
Anybody know how much that would cost?:bloated:

Hrm....actually, a very bad bad bad idea. Most people would say it's due to the high static CR, but 10.6:1 isn't really much of an issue. You can safely run a little boost on that without problems. The primary concern I would have is with the lightweight components. The reciprocating assembly of the ITR is designed to spin up quickly to stratospheric rpm, but the problem is that they're not designed to withstand massive pressure. Look at it kind of this way. The ITR has high static CR, which gives it great power at TDC and plenty of driving momentum to spin up those lightweight pistons and rods, but that's a short burst of power that doesn't follow the piston down. It's like a bat hitting a ball. The energy from the swung bat hits the ball and the ball carries the energy and continues to travel away from the bat. Now, if you turbo that puppy, you're increasing the cylinder pressure and putting a downward force on those same lightweight pistons and rods all the way down. The energy isn't transferred into the piston and quickly diminished, it's staying right on top of it. That's bound to take it's toll on all the bearings. You could always change out the pistons and rods and lower the static CR, but that defeats the entire purpose of starting with a B18C5. A big part of that 197 hp is from the high static CR and lightweight assembly. You'll probably want to rethink adding boost to that motor. You can definitely do it, but it's just not the ideal motor to do it to...

just get the turbo i think u will be happier cuz if u get a supercharger after a while i feel u will be like :o , just an opinion

Originally posted by neouser


Hrm....actually, a very bad bad bad idea. Most people would say it's due to the high static CR, but 10.6:1 isn't really much of an issue. You can safely run a little boost on that without problems. The primary concern I would have is with the lightweight components. The reciprocating assembly of the ITR is designed to spin up quickly to stratospheric rpm, but the problem is that they're not designed to withstand massive pressure. Look at it kind of this way. The ITR has high static CR, which gives it great power at TDC and plenty of driving momentum to spin up those lightweight pistons and rods, but that's a short burst of power that doesn't follow the piston down. It's like a bat hitting a ball. The energy from the swung bat hits the ball and the ball carries the energy and continues to travel away from the bat. Now, if you turbo that puppy, you're increasing the cylinder pressure and putting a downward force on those same lightweight pistons and rods all the way down. The energy isn't transferred into the piston and quickly diminished, it's staying right on top of it. That's bound to take it's toll on all the bearings. You could always change out the pistons and rods and lower the static CR, but that defeats the entire purpose of starting with a B18C5. A big part of that 197 hp is from the high static CR and lightweight assembly. You'll probably want to rethink adding boost to that motor. You can definitely do it, but it's just not the ideal motor to do it to...

hmm... ok thanks. But what about supercharger then?
Same problem? If so then how can I increase horsepower/torque without blowing the engine? Would adding a larger exhaust pipe help?:confused:

Same thing. Boost is boost, period. Those are just 2 different ways of making it. It's not that you can't do it. It's just not a good idea, in my opinion. It will definitely work, and you'll definitely make much more power, but the components just may not be up to the job for a long period of time. The B18C1 is really a better candidate. If you do decide to boost it, make sure you tune the a/f and the ignition timing carefully and you'll get much more out of your motor in the longrun...

Bah...
To risky...
Much to risky...
I'll just add a larger exhaust pipe.
I like the one called the hmm...
Fireball?
Can't remember.:rolleyes:

I love my turbo.....It goes wwwwiiiiiissssshhhhhhhh.....That's exactly what they need: a wish.

Yes... I love the sound of Turbo when it kicks in!
WHOOOPSSSSHHH!
But I don't think I will add it on my RSX Type R though.
I'm going to keep it original.
All I'm going to add is a NA Fireball Exhaust made my Zigen I think.:D

Originally posted by Type R
Yes... I love the sound of Turbo when it kicks in!
WHOOOPSSSSHHH!
But I don't think I will add it on my RSX Type R though.
I'm going to keep it original.
All I'm going to add is a NA Fireball Exhaust made my Zigen I think.:D
I don't think the RSX Type-R is coming to Canada for another 2 or 3+ years.

Im new with engine mods and turbos etc.. what would the 0-60 be for a civic with turbo and just an exhaust. For some reason noone uses 0-60 times:silly2: Im just new at this and i want to know what i can beat :P
Anyone have any idea?

Originally posted by bez
Im new with engine mods and turbos etc.. what would the 0-60 be for a civic with turbo and just an exhaust. For some reason noone uses 0-60 times:silly2: Im just new at this and i want to know what i can beat :P
Anyone have any idea?

It's kind of hard to quote a 0-60MPH time on a turbo'd ride. You can, if you want, but that won't give you an actual idea of how powerful the turbo is. Some of the bigger turbo kits (FMAX and REV HARD) give large amounts of boost at higher RPM's and get better results in a longer stretch (1/4MI). The Greddy kit, being a smaller turbo, will give boost sooner, but is limited to the amount of boost it can put out because of it's size. A car with a small turbo might have a better 0-60MPH time, but a larger one will give you better 1/4MI ET, which it pretty much what everyone goes for. If you want to race it constantly, get a bigger one. I wanted mine for an everyday drive and instant gratification, so I got the Greddy kit. That kit is also the only kit that is CARB legal (*sniff sniff*). If you go with a big turbo, you can use a small shot of NOS to get off the line to give the turbo time to spool. Using NOS (depending which method you use) can act as an intercooler, reducing the temperature of the intake air, thus, increasing HP at the exact same boost level. A good example is if anyone lives in a climate (like me) that's usually hot. I have a turbo without an intercooler right now (for another week) and when winter came around, the ext air temp dropped to around 50 degrees. WOW!! I was amazed at the difference cold air made at 5psi. Hope this helps.

http://home.satx.rr.com/importvelocity/

SleeperCivic you mentioned a small shot of NOS with your turbo:eek2:. I have been trying to do my homework to see if you can skip the intercooler if you are running 5-10 lbs of boost. Currently I have a 60 shot (fogger) on a stock internals, except for Crower 63402's cams. :eek: I am going to try to put on a Pulsar Turbo (tinny little thing), I have lying around, to see the improvement in the quarter. I want to avoid the intercooler for now, do you or any one else think I can? and not over stuff the engine? I have read all about the importance of tuning, ignition, and spark and will accommodate appropriately.

Thank you for your time.

P.S. MaT3T4 if you read this would you please comment, I respect your opinion and have been to your web site and read what you wrote about turbos.

Sorry about the empty post above, I'm a F'kin New Guy.:confused: